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⇒ All Things Boeing ... NASA may send Starliner home without its crew
”Boeing … succeeded in getting NASA astronauts to the International Space Station, following weeks of delays. Returning them to Earth on the same spacecraft is proving another challenge. Problems with leaks and thrusters emerged after Boeing's Starliner vehicle launched this month with the astronauts Barry Wilmore and Sunita Williams on board …
“With the latest postponement, the astronauts would spend about 20 days in space, more than double the roughly eight days originally planned. Starliner has been pinned down by two main issues: a series of helium leaks in a propulsion system and problems with several thrusters that are used to maneuver the vehicle. NASA and Boeing teams have been studying both issues before they permit Starliner to attempt to leave the station with Wilmore and Williams …”
Excerpted from The Wall Street Journal June 20, 2024
if not for boeing, i would be embarrassed to be a shareholder in viasat.
interesting real world cultural lab experiment going on...china's boeing clone. after decades of subsidies, the CCP is highly motivated on reputation to further domestic AND export numbers; far more than safety. i suspect they have alternative management career paths for gross negligence\incompetence.
Charlie On The MTA. Yes, indeed. Apparently, the astronauts are safe for the time being inside the ISS.
To paraphrase "Crash" Davis in Bull Durham: "Boeing couldn't hit water if they fell out of a f*****g boat."
This is a dreadful state of affairs. I remember Apollo 13. THOSE boys responded to a huge problem and got the space-guys back home. Quality control EVERYWHERE has fallen into the toilet. On the earlier missions, was it all NASA guys who manufactured the parts and pieces? Seems to me we can't AFFORD to have the whole thing done in-house anymore, due to enormous deficit spending. Thus, oversight and quality control just suck. Like the food at school, my first two years in Spokane.
An additional bit of information, slightly edited, from that WSJ article:
NASA and Boeing are investigating five helium leaks identified in the vehicle’s service module—a propulsion system that includes the thrusters. One was noted before the flight began.
Starliner needs about seven hours of helium on board to finish the flight, and has about 70 hours remaining.
Five thrusters on Starliner temporarily failed as the vehicle made its final rendezvous with the ISS, but four came back online. One thruster will be shut off for the remainder of the mission.
A Boeing vice president overseeing the Starliner program said that the Starliner flight has accomplished 77 of 87 test objectives so far.
At least it seems there is an ample supply of helium for the return, despite the leakage problem. The helium powers 28 "system thrusters" on the service module, five of which failed during the flight to the space station. Four of those have been cleared for reuse, and one has been taken out of service.
For sure, they are safe. …. The old Kingston Trio song came to mind and couldn’t resist. Always there is at least 1 spare craft attached to the ISS as a safety precaution. Sometimes there are 3 or 4 different craft docked there. Pretty sure that’s the case today.
However … it could prove somewhat embarrassing for Boeing were the Starliner deemed unfit for crewed reentry and the Boeing pilots forced to hitch a ride home on a SpaceX vehicle. Just noticed last evening one of my fixed income managers is holding an awful lot of Boeing paper. I hope he knows what he’s doing. -
PS - An AI generated search says there are currently 8 docking ports on the ISS - 4 in the Russian segment and 4 in the U.S. segment. So, a maximum of 8 craft could dock at once. Keep in mind that some of these ports are used for uncrewed supply ships.
Wow! Just awesome. I may be the only person on the planet that hadn’t heard Hatfield’s rendition of Bowie’s classic. @msf’s post prompted me to do a little searching. Quite a bit online about it, including a number of interviews with Hatfield.
ISTM being “locked-up in a tin can” high above the earth might drive one to do some weird things.
It is odd that a company like Boeing could fall apart while others like Toyota can continue to build very reliable products, but I think it is due to a common factor GREED
The same ongoing disasters are very common in health care where the bean counters and private equity have been allowed to take over, putting profits as their only priority
Barron's article on HCA is a good example, but even non profit hospitals have thrown the professionals out of the window and make decisions based on margins only also
Doctors are told what to do, how many patients to see, what medical devices to use or not use based on economics.
Occasionally they object and get fired. But this whistleblower won.
My wife and I are going nuts tying to ensure our daughter's procedure at a major Medical Center is authorized and paid for. It has been almost a month and we are both experienced health care professionals and know what to ask.
And the CEOs of these crappy places make thousands of times more than the workers
I’m not up to speed on how the thrusters are used. If their main role is simply to orient the craft before the de-orbit burn, then they might give it a try even if some are faulty, figuring they can return back to the ISS if necessary (though redocking could be a problem). But if they are needed after the de-orbit burn to stabilize the craft during reentry (as I would expect), than the stakes are much higher and neither NASA nor Boeing want to gamble in that case and risk human life.
Helium (non-combustible of course) - Sometimes helium is used to maintain pressure on rocket fuel until all the fuel has been expended. In this case, it appears that the simple release of pressurized helium through “jets” provides enough force to orient the vehicle and keep it stable.
"We're not stuck on the ISS," said Mark Nappi, Boeing's vice president in charge of the Starliner program. "It's pretty painful to read the things that are out there. We've gotten a really good test flight that's been accomplished so far, and it's being viewed rather negatively.”
"When it is a contingency situation, we’re ready to put the crew on the spacecraft and bring them home as a lifeboat," Bowersox said. “For the nominal entry, we want to look at the data more before we make the final call to put the crew aboard the vehicle, and it's a serious enough call that we’ll bring the senior management team together (for approval)."
BA hired a new CEO, who will be based in Seattle and not at their HQ next to the law makers. The other good news is, he is an engineer. He came out of retirement to take this job.
Lucky for BA that the market did not care for its (subpar) earnings released today.
Comments
”Boeing … succeeded in getting NASA astronauts to the International Space Station, following weeks of delays. Returning them to Earth on the same spacecraft is proving another challenge. Problems with leaks and thrusters emerged after Boeing's Starliner vehicle launched this month with the astronauts Barry Wilmore and Sunita Williams on board …
“With the latest postponement, the astronauts would spend about 20 days in space, more than double the roughly eight days originally planned. Starliner has been pinned down by two main issues: a series of helium leaks in a propulsion system and problems with several thrusters that are used to maneuver the vehicle. NASA and Boeing teams have been studying both issues before they permit Starliner to attempt to leave the station with Wilmore and Williams …”
Excerpted from The Wall Street Journal June 20, 2024
interesting real world cultural lab experiment going on...china's boeing clone.
after decades of subsidies, the CCP is highly motivated on reputation to further domestic AND export numbers; far more than safety.
i suspect they have alternative management career paths for gross negligence\incompetence.
To paraphrase "Crash" Davis in Bull Durham: "Boeing couldn't hit water if they fell out of a f*****g boat."
This is a dreadful state of affairs. I remember Apollo 13. THOSE boys responded to a huge problem and got the space-guys back home. Quality control EVERYWHERE has fallen into the toilet. On the earlier missions, was it all NASA guys who manufactured the parts and pieces? Seems to me we can't AFFORD to have the whole thing done in-house anymore, due to enormous deficit spending. Thus, oversight and quality control just suck. Like the food at school, my first two years in Spokane.
For sure, they are safe. …. The old Kingston Trio song came to mind and couldn’t resist. Always there is at least 1 spare craft attached to the ISS as a safety precaution. Sometimes there are 3 or 4 different craft docked there. Pretty sure that’s the case today.
However … it could prove somewhat embarrassing for Boeing were the Starliner deemed unfit for crewed reentry and the Boeing pilots forced to hitch a ride home on a SpaceX vehicle. Just noticed last evening one of my fixed income managers is holding an awful lot of Boeing paper. I hope he knows what he’s doing.
-
PS - An AI generated search says there are currently 8 docking ports on the ISS - 4 in the Russian segment and 4 in the U.S. segment. So, a maximum of 8 craft could dock at once. Keep in mind that some of these ports are used for uncrewed supply ships.
In the same vein is this cover of David Bowie's Space Oddity recorded in the ISS a decade ago.
ISTM being “locked-up in a tin can” high above the earth might drive one to do some weird things.
The same ongoing disasters are very common in health care where the bean counters and private equity have been allowed to take over, putting profits as their only priority
Barron's article on HCA is a good example, but even non profit hospitals have thrown the professionals out of the window and make decisions based on margins only also
Doctors are told what to do, how many patients to see, what medical devices to use or not use based on economics.
Occasionally they object and get fired. But this whistleblower won.
https://www.capecodtimes.com/story/news/2024/05/16/cardiac-procedure-medicare-claims-cape-cod-hospital-richard-zelman-tavr/73721900007/
Patients ( ie customers) suffer
My wife and I are going nuts tying to ensure our daughter's procedure at a major Medical Center is authorized and paid for. It has been almost a month and we are both experienced health care professionals and know what to ask.
And the CEOs of these crappy places make thousands of times more than the workers
Helium (non-combustible of course) - Sometimes helium is used to maintain pressure on rocket fuel until all the fuel has been expended. In this case, it appears that the simple release of pressurized helium through “jets” provides enough force to orient the vehicle and keep it stable.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-26/boeing-faces-new-whistleblower-claims-of-lapses-on-some-787-jets?srnd=homepage-americas
"We're not stuck on the ISS," said Mark Nappi, Boeing's vice president in charge of the Starliner program. "It's pretty painful to read the things that are out there. We've gotten a really good test flight that's been accomplished so far, and it's being viewed rather negatively.”
"When it is a contingency situation, we’re ready to put the crew on the spacecraft and bring them home as a lifeboat," Bowersox said. “For the nominal entry, we want to look at the data more before we make the final call to put the crew aboard the vehicle, and it's a serious enough call that we’ll bring the senior management team together (for approval)."
BA hired a new CEO, who will be based in Seattle and not at their HQ next to the law makers. The other good news is, he is an engineer. He came out of retirement to take this job.
Lucky for BA that the market did not care for its (subpar) earnings released today.
The Story