Here's a statement of the obvious: The opinions expressed here are those of the participants, not those of the Mutual Fund Observer. We cannot vouch for the accuracy or appropriateness of any of it, though we do encourage civility and good humor.
Oklahoma venue management asks Trump campaign for health plan ahead of rally
Paul DeMuro, one of the attorneys for the city residents and business owners, said during the call that “an indoor mass gathering such as this, without adherence to the CDC guidelines, creates grave, imminent and certain public risk to the community.” ... “Nineteen thousand people, chanting and screaming and yelling in a big box in the middle of the worst pandemic we may have ever faced as a country — it’s madness to let this event go forward,” DeMuro added.
And how many Biden supporters will be turned away at the voting stations in November. I'm not worried about tRump's supporters (it's their right to support him). I worry about anyone else who is not allowed to exercise their right to vote safely and surely. #Vote
How many Biden supporters would wait in line 5 days to see him speak? Be worried ...
How may Trump supporters would wait in line 5 days to see him speak? All I've found are reports that the number is greater than zero. More people than that line up to get the newest iPhone. Be worried - those iPhone people network
I tend to think the Biden folks who did show up (despite the health risks) wouldn’t have turned tail and gone back home due to some “radical” protesters:
Anybody come across anything re whether the pandemic and disproportionate loss of life among the elderly is affecting SS trust fund solvency? I can see it both ways. Fewer oldsters to draw SS benefits is positive longer term. But higher medical costs paid out under Medicare is a negative in the short run. Than there’s all the troubled private / public pension systems that stand to benefit if the elderly population is reduced substantially.
Reportedly KPop fans and teenagers were scoring hundreds and thousands of tickets and royally punked the campaign -- if true, I want to give them all a gigantic hug and atta-person for a job well done! All this week, the campaing kept screaming how they had 500, 600, 700K tickets issued ..... and then like 9000 show up. AF-1 flew over the arena and there was nobody on the streets to see it ---- and the overflow section was being dropped 30 minutes before the event was to kick off. Pathetic!
The rage-tweeting later on shall be epic --- Parscale might want to think about flying commercial back to DC tonght.
Edit: Most MSM I've seen tonight have said nothing about protestors blocking entrances or anything like that. IMO the campaign is spinning their horrid attendance numbers very early b/c it's such an obvious emarassment.
Listened to the speech on Fox. Fascinating study in persuasive oratory. Certainly knows how to work a supportive audience.
Hoping for best, but hard to believe this won’t make Covid 19 situation even worse than already is. And he made mention of ”my good friend”, Brazil’s Bolsonaro, who has also ignored sound medical advice.
@davidrmoran, I thought the crowd ate it up. Did you watch or listen? BTW - I’m speaking only of the speech delivery (oratorical) techniques, not the quality of argument, reasoning, evidence, etc.
Here’s some links to studies, descriptions, analysis of his speaking style.
Well, "persuasive" has always been a basic requirement for snake-oil salesmen, hasn't it?
I prefer to say “It plays in Peoria.”
It also plays in most of Michigan outside of the major population centers like Wayne and Oakland counties in the southern part of the lower peninsula. North of the “thumb” area (visible on any map) is heavily pro Trump. Guns and God are big up here. So, geographically speaking (not population-wise) , Michigan is probably 80% pro-Trump. However, based on population it’s pretty even.
Al Jazeera headline tonight: "Trump addresses campaign rally at half-empty Tulsa arena. US president says he wants coronavirus testing to slow down while six campaign staff members test positive for COVID-19." Frikkin' unbelievable.
@hank Were you persuaded? I admit that I have wondered at times why I refuse to listen to a sentence he says. Perhaps I have been afraid he might pull me to the dark side just like he has, IMO, almost half of the US.
I was persuaded a long time ago to support and vote for a change in Washington. With this, even being a Southern Democrat, I voted for Trump in this past election and I plan to do so again.
It bothers me deeply how the Democrat elected have followed Nancy Pelosi and Chuch Schumer and have not been more of an independent thinking and of voting posture. I was amased and became very alarmed during Adam Shiff's presentation and impeachment trail with his false claims against President Trump. For me, Shiff should have been the one tried and impeached from office for his Kangroo Court prodeedings. Pelosi and Schumer should go as well being part of this.
I was going to stay away from making political type post and comments since this is an investment board. However, others don't seem to be able to do this.
Most likely, with this, I want be back on the board until after the November election.
And, by the way ... I recieved a mailing form Joe Biden. It ask ... Skeeter, Are You With Me? My answer ... that was mailed back to him ... Not this time, Joe. Not this time.
Both Chuch Schmer and Nancy Pelosi were members of Congress, blaming President Reagan for all our problems. Thirty two years later, both are still in Congress, except now they are blaming President Trump for all our problems.
I say, "Drain the Swamp!" And, Biden is part of the swamp.
Persuading those who already support you. Is that not an oxymoron?
Maybe it’s the other way around. They’ve come to hear him speak because they already like what he says and how he says it. He’s giving them what they’ve come to see. That’s the scary part. These are my neighbors, the fella who fixes my plumbing or sells me a tank of gas or a 6-pack of beer - and in some cases they’re my friends.
Old skeet. You wear that term Southern Democrat as if it were a badge of honor, yet in fact it was a term for support of slavery and later jim crow laws and segregation. Sad in my opinion.
You have a right to speak your mind. I think you injected a fair amount of politics. I won’t respond or try to analyze your various points, as it would just serve to emphasize the political aspect here - the very thing you claim to be opposed to.
However, I did not find the thread until than as overtly political. I started it from the public health perspective as there has been much said here about the Covid-19 pandemic. There was some drift. I suppose. But if you look at my response above to @davidrmoran I’ve linked 8 sources which mostly praise Trump’s speech style / persuasive abilities. I myself described his performance last night as a form of “persuasive oratory.”
It’s hard, if not impossible, to look at the monumental forces shaping our national well-being (health, race relations, law enforcement, court rulings, etc.) without touching on politics. Harder still to turn our eyes away and pretend none of this is taking place.
Tulsa Fire Marshal says there were 6200 attendees. The arena holds 19,000. The campaign 'released' 800K tickets and had overflow space that went un-needed.
Hank said "It’s hard, if not impossible, to look at the monumental forces shaping our national well-being (health, race relations, law enforcement, court rulings, etc.) without touching on politics. Harder still to turn our eyes away and pretend none of this is taking place."
I ask my neighbors all the time about these forces and events, It's like they have never seen or heard about them. All is well in the cold-hearted, blindfolded, braindead world. The only response i ever hear is that their vote will cancel out mine and then they smile.
While it may have been madness to allow the event to take place, quite a number of our species seem to enjoy the spectacle of madness. We are horrified, but we still watch.
In this forum the great majority of financial conversation is well thought-through, based on research, personal experience, or sources of reasonable integrity. The commentary of the participants is usually intelligent and based on facts, or at least on information which is genuinely believed to be valid. When there is disagreement over the interpretation of financial matters the comments are civil and by their nature usually promote a fairly thorough examination of the issues being discussed.
Because of this environment it's only natural that we construct mental images of these people who we really don't know, and who we will likely never actually meet. In the great majority of cases these mental constructs are very positive: it's only natural to feel that other people are reasonable, intelligent, and thoughtful... and therefore very much like ourselves in their evaluation of the world.
So it's something of a shock to find that one of these people- especially one who is a major longtime contributor, civil, intelligent and courteous, and obviously very knowledgeable about things financial, evidently observes the political world out there and appreciates actions and beliefs that are in direct contradiction to one's own.
If we apply the same degree of scrutiny and testing of accuracy and factuality to political matters that we do to financial matters, then we should, theoretically, all come to conclusions which fall within a reasonable range of believability. This should actually be easier in the political arena than in the financial- after all, a lot of digging is sometimes needed on the financial side, whereas much of the political evidence is quite public and well documented.
It's important to note that a "reasonable range of believeability" leaves plenty of room for different and opposing views on how to handle various political questions. There is certainly no "one correct answer" to many political issues, and history shows that many times some sort of compromise may be the best approach to many problems.
The current president of the United States is a well documented serial liar. Seldom does a day go by that he doesn't actively promote social division and dissension. He has obvious contempt for any individual or group who doesn't happen to be of white Anglo-European descent. He has commented approvingly on those who have used physical violence against others. He has promoted civil disobedience against local and state governments with whom he happens to disagree.
It is well documented that he has no use for briefings or background information crucial to guiding the United States through the intricate pitfalls of word diplomacy. He is held in contempt and ridicule by many leaders of the western democracies.
He ridicules fact-based scientific knowledge regarding health matters and global warming. He has attempted to ignore the current pandemic by actively ignoring factual information, and suppressing testing. He deliberately goes out of his way to destroy nature preserves and set-asides that have been accumulated over many years by previous administrations of both major political parties.
Contrary to an opinion expressed above, it is a well documented fact that he attempted to use the leverage of the presidency to bargain assets of the United States in exchange for dirt on his main political challenger.
So it is very distressing to see that one of our group here at MFO, valued for his help and thoughtful commentary, can apparently be so completely blind to the facts and reality of the real world that we all share, and actually appreciate a man of Trump's character.
Dismayed to read Skeet's opinion and intention to re-vote for the Trumpster. On the other hand, is uncle Joe the savior? Certainly not. But would the country be in better hands if Joe wins? No doubt, it would be.... Nothing in the Orange Abortion's life prepared him for ANY of what being President is all about. He came in cold. Never expected to win. And he actually didn't: Hillary got more votes. The goddam Electoral College gave him the "win." It needs to be killed. But will it ever be killed? I bet NOT. Constitutional Amendments are hard to come by. And there are those in flyover territory whose votes are given outsized power by the EC. Given that they are in the minority party nationally, they won't easily give up their vested interest in keeping the EC afloat.
The Trumpster is not just a very bad President. He is corrupt and without any sort of moral compass. "Despicable" describes him. I want to drain the swamp, too. Repugnants have no integrity, but the Demublicans are still too connected to the status quo.
... But between them, they have government all locked-up. And the public--- the VOTERS--- drink the Kool-Aid and cannot conceive of another option. More's the pity. People VOLUNTARILY enclose themselves in just one of two boxes. Pick your poison. Others might chime in and say they have not been locked-in, that they have, over the years, voted for candidates along the way from BOTH parties. Like I said: pick your poison. One more thought: the way the Republican Party has devolved into ethical nothingness and shameless idolatry of Big Money makes them, without doubt, Repugnant. People will make distinctions between national-level candidates and local ones. But what does it matter? And why would you want to be ASSOCIATED in any way with such moral depravity? Ding. This is not Nelson Rockefeller's Republican Party, nor Ike's. As far as the East is from the West.
Comments
Trump campaign CANCELS the President's speech to Tulsa's outdoor crowd, claiming radical protesters https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8443507/Trump-campaign-CANCELS-Presidents-speech-Tulsas-outdoor-crowd-claiming-radical-protesters.html
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But this is downright scary. Maybe the real reason some went back home.
6 Trump Staffers Test Positive For COVID-19 Ahead Of Tulsa Rally
https://www.npr.org/2020/06/20/881270479/6-trump-staffers-test-positive-for-covid-19-ahead-of-tulsa-rally
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Anybody come across anything re whether the pandemic and disproportionate loss of life among the elderly is affecting SS trust fund solvency? I can see it both ways. Fewer oldsters to draw SS benefits is positive longer term. But higher medical costs paid out under Medicare is a negative in the short run. Than there’s all the troubled private / public pension systems that stand to benefit if the elderly population is reduced substantially.
The rage-tweeting later on shall be epic --- Parscale might want to think about flying commercial back to DC tonght.
Edit: Most MSM I've seen tonight have said nothing about protestors blocking entrances or anything like that. IMO the campaign is spinning their horrid attendance numbers very early b/c it's such an obvious emarassment.
Hoping for best, but hard to believe this won’t make Covid 19 situation even worse than already is. And he made mention of ”my good friend”, Brazil’s Bolsonaro, who has also ignored sound medical advice.
Here’s some links to studies, descriptions, analysis of his speaking style.
https://theconversation.com/what-aristotle-can-teach-us-about-trumps-rhetoric-107761
https://qz.com/965004/rhetoric-scholars-pinpoint-why-trumps-inarticulate-speaking-style-is-so-persuasive/
https://archive.thinkprogress.org/donald-trump-may-sound-like-a-clown-but-he-is-a-rhetoric-pro-like-cicero-ac40fd1cda79/
https://www2.psych.ubc.ca/~dpaulhus/research/DARK_TRIAD/ARTICLES/PAID 2017 with.Ahmadian-Azarshahi.pdf
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6939049/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2405844019367416
https://www.thelanguagelab.ca/posts/the-language-lab-comments-on-persuasion-techniques-donald-trump-is-using-to-win-the-election/
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/1/11/14238274/trumps-speaking-style-press-conference-linguists-explain
https://improveyourpublicspeaking.com.au/5-public-speaking-skills-donald-trump-gets-right/
It also plays in most of Michigan outside of the major population centers like Wayne and Oakland counties in the southern part of the lower peninsula. North of the “thumb” area (visible on any map) is heavily pro Trump. Guns and God are big up here. So, geographically speaking (not population-wise) , Michigan is probably 80% pro-Trump. However, based on population it’s pretty even.
US president says he wants coronavirus testing to slow down while six campaign staff members test positive for COVID-19." Frikkin' unbelievable.
It bothers me deeply how the Democrat elected have followed Nancy Pelosi and Chuch Schumer and have not been more of an independent thinking and of voting posture. I was amased and became very alarmed during Adam Shiff's presentation and impeachment trail with his false claims against President Trump. For me, Shiff should have been the one tried and impeached from office for his Kangroo Court prodeedings. Pelosi and Schumer should go as well being part of this.
I was going to stay away from making political type post and comments since this is an investment board. However, others don't seem to be able to do this.
Most likely, with this, I want be back on the board until after the November election.
And, by the way ... I recieved a mailing form Joe Biden. It ask ... Skeeter, Are You With Me?
My answer ... that was mailed back to him ... Not this time, Joe. Not this time.
Both Chuch Schmer and Nancy Pelosi were members of Congress, blaming President Reagan for all our problems. Thirty two years later, both are still in Congress, except now they are blaming President Trump for all our problems.
I say, "Drain the Swamp!" And, Biden is part of the swamp.
Old_Skeet
I wish I could say more.
You have a right to speak your mind. I think you injected a fair amount of politics. I won’t respond or try to analyze your various points, as it would just serve to emphasize the political aspect here - the very thing you claim to be opposed to.
However, I did not find the thread until than as overtly political. I started it from the public health perspective as there has been much said here about the Covid-19 pandemic. There was some drift. I suppose. But if you look at my response above to @davidrmoran I’ve linked 8 sources which mostly praise Trump’s speech style / persuasive abilities. I myself described his performance last night as a form of “persuasive oratory.”
It’s hard, if not impossible, to look at the monumental forces shaping our national well-being (health, race relations, law enforcement, court rulings, etc.) without touching on politics. Harder still to turn our eyes away and pretend none of this is taking place.
Somebody sure took a walk of shame last night.....and he looks like utter crap, too. Like he knows he's gonna lose.
https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1274687177113337856/pu/vid/1280x720/OI3l8hWUKPTX1tnZ.mp4?tag=10
Tulsa Fire Marshal says there were 6200 attendees. The arena holds 19,000. The campaign 'released' 800K tickets and had overflow space that went un-needed.
Couldn't happen to a nicer person. *cackle*
I ask my neighbors all the time about these forces and events, It's like they have never seen or heard about them. All is well in the cold-hearted, blindfolded, braindead world. The only response i ever hear is that their vote will cancel out mine and then they smile.
Because of this environment it's only natural that we construct mental images of these people who we really don't know, and who we will likely never actually meet. In the great majority of cases these mental constructs are very positive: it's only natural to feel that other people are reasonable, intelligent, and thoughtful... and therefore very much like ourselves in their evaluation of the world.
So it's something of a shock to find that one of these people- especially one who is a major longtime contributor, civil, intelligent and courteous, and obviously very knowledgeable about things financial, evidently observes the political world out there and appreciates actions and beliefs that are in direct contradiction to one's own.
If we apply the same degree of scrutiny and testing of accuracy and factuality to political matters that we do to financial matters, then we should, theoretically, all come to conclusions which fall within a reasonable range of believability. This should actually be easier in the political arena than in the financial- after all, a lot of digging is sometimes needed on the financial side, whereas much of the political evidence is quite public and well documented.
It's important to note that a "reasonable range of believeability" leaves plenty of room for different and opposing views on how to handle various political questions. There is certainly no "one correct answer" to many political issues, and history shows that many times some sort of compromise may be the best approach to many problems.
The current president of the United States is a well documented serial liar. Seldom does a day go by that he doesn't actively promote social division and dissension. He has obvious contempt for any individual or group who doesn't happen to be of white Anglo-European descent. He has commented approvingly on those who have used physical violence against others. He has promoted civil disobedience against local and state governments with whom he happens to disagree.
It is well documented that he has no use for briefings or background information crucial to guiding the United States through the intricate pitfalls of word diplomacy. He is held in contempt and ridicule by many leaders of the western democracies.
He ridicules fact-based scientific knowledge regarding health matters and global warming. He has attempted to ignore the current pandemic by actively ignoring factual information, and suppressing testing. He deliberately goes out of his way to destroy nature preserves and set-asides that have been accumulated over many years by previous administrations of both major political parties.
Contrary to an opinion expressed above, it is a well documented fact that he attempted to use the leverage of the presidency to bargain assets of the United States in exchange for dirt on his main political challenger.
So it is very distressing to see that one of our group here at MFO, valued for his help and thoughtful commentary, can apparently be so completely blind to the facts and reality of the real world that we all share, and actually appreciate a man of Trump's character.
Very hard to understand.
OJ
yeah, so troubling to read anyone still saying the laughable and utterly false 'drain the swamp'
calls into question judgment in all matters
'not this time' for biden? as if there is going to be another??
meanwhile, tweet of the weekend, even this weekend (h/t al franken):
6200 people at Trump rally in Tulsa. Acts that had bigger crowds at the same venue in 2019:
- Sha Na Na
- The Pips (w/o Gladys Knight)
- Loverboy
- John Tesh
- The West Virginia Touring Company of 'La Traviata'
The Trumpster is not just a very bad President. He is corrupt and without any sort of moral compass. "Despicable" describes him. I want to drain the swamp, too. Repugnants have no integrity, but the Demublicans are still too connected to the status quo.
... But between them, they have government all locked-up. And the public--- the VOTERS--- drink the Kool-Aid and cannot conceive of another option. More's the pity. People VOLUNTARILY enclose themselves in just one of two boxes. Pick your poison. Others might chime in and say they have not been locked-in, that they have, over the years, voted for candidates along the way from BOTH parties. Like I said: pick your poison. One more thought: the way the Republican Party has devolved into ethical nothingness and shameless idolatry of Big Money makes them, without doubt, Repugnant. People will make distinctions between national-level candidates and local ones. But what does it matter? And why would you want to be ASSOCIATED in any way with such moral depravity? Ding. This is not Nelson Rockefeller's Republican Party, nor Ike's. As far as the East is from the West.