Here's a statement of the obvious: The opinions expressed here are those of the participants, not those of the Mutual Fund Observer. We cannot vouch for the accuracy or appropriateness of any of it, though we do encourage civility and good humor.
When a local watering hole had run out of my usual and standard Macallan 12, they poured a Laphroaig. Now, I can't be sure it was the 10 year cask strength, but the characteristics would be similar.
It was way too peaty for me, with a medicinal bite...but, many would find that a good thing, and this bottle is highly acclaimed it appears.
When I was in graduate school one of the students did a map of chemical components of scotch using one of those newfangled computer things and determined the cheap scotches that mapped in the nearby space of more expensive scotches. The student tasting session (blind, of course) to verify the taste similarities was less conclusive than the chemistry but a good time was had by all. (Sorry, I don't remember the detailed results but I do remember that the one that was supposed to be the best scotch tasted soapy to me.)
If Quarter Cask is to peaty try Dalmore... If you have had great investment success thus far go for the King Alexander III... If you have been mostly in bonds you might have to settle for the 12 year old.
Enjoyed all the responses. I just bought a bottle of Bushmills, which of course is IRISH Whisky, and not highly valued among those-in-the-know. But it takes me back to my memories of the Antrim coast. When comparing Bushmills standard white label to Jamesons, reviewers somehow prefer the Jamesons. I like to add a slice of lime..
As for the Laphroaig 10 Year Old Cask Strength: I am intentionally curious to experience the pointed peatiness of it. I do understand it's not an offering intended for neophytes. Soon..... Recently, I must say my experience with The Balvenie 10 Year was quite positive. https://img.thewhiskyexchange.com/900/balob.10yov7.jpg
My 'go to" Scotches are mainly Speysides - Balvenies (Carribean Cask - yum!), Macallan, Glenlivet and Mortloch are my faves. Also like some of the far-north ones like Jura and Scapa. Peaty ones from the Islay region are definitely NOT starter whiskys unless you add a drop or two of water to them first.
Some of the private-label whiskys you can get from the Single Malt Whisky Society are amazing, and nearly all seem to be cask strength.
@crash It is pronounced Le-Frogge. IMHO it is not worth the price. It is extremely "smokey". You actually think you are drinking burnt wood. I wonder if they sorta burn the cask before aging the whiskey in it. It is one of those things - you either like it or you don't. Costco in California is the cheapest place to buy it (Costco in TX, you really need to lower your prices).
@PRESSmUP I have never even come across a Bushmill Single Malt. There are so many blended whiskeys which I generally stay away from. I drink mine neat, so frankly not a lot choice for me to chose from. With Soda/Water a lot of whiskey's become palatable. I will look for Bushmill single malt next time I'm in store.
@Ted Johnny Walker's is the big kahuna, but they make blends. Red Label is crap, Black Label is okay, Double Black is worth it, Green and Gold I haven't had, but Blue Label which is top of the line, if EXTREMELY good. I had two bottles. One I opened for my elder nephew's graduation, and the other I will open for my elder's graduation. They cost $150 for 750 ML, but I got them for about $100 a piece while on cruise.
@Amir I would definitely say I don't recall having a Speyside I haven't been able to drink neat. It is generally "safe" to buy Speyside. I just feel Highlands are superior because higher altitudes with lower air pressures do a better job of aging the whiskey as it "breathes" in and out of the wood.
An interesting side story I heard from a store manager, not sure if it's true. Cardhu - pronounced "car dow" - is the one of the base single malts for Johny Walker. There was a time, it went off the shelves and I couldn't find it for the longest time. Bottles of Cardhu were selling on eBay for a pretty penny (and if anyone buying food items on eBay they are just crazy). Apparently Cardhu tried to "up" their deal with Johny Walker and the latter simply bought off outstanding stock in the market to make sure Johny Walker Black - their best selling product - wouldn't suffer due to shortages. Not sure how things played out, but Cardhu then came back onto the market. After that I never tried Cardhu, just like after waiting for a mutual fund to open, I just found others...
@sma3 - Off Topic category was only created to talk about whiskey. I thought you knew that.
FWIW, I've stocked up on various Ainsley Brae's but have decided to give whiskey a break. Someone told me AGED Rum is very good and the good one's are as smooth and even indistinguishable from whiskey. Will report some day. Rum has to be cheaper and than whiskey, or I wouldn't pay up, but if it can be drunk neat, I will use the savings to DCA down into HSGFX.
Hmmmm ... I tend toward Oban, mostly because I've such fond memories of the town and like the "smallest of the distilleries" sort of story. Sadly, I'm so un sew fis tea cated that I can best enjoy Scotch (or Irish whiskey, which for a long time had a much greater cachet) if it's being hidden by honey and spices or a bit of soda.
JW Red is their peatiest blend except for Double Black, which is really strong. Most blends that have black in the name are like that (the 'new' Famous Grouse Black, e.g.). JW Green and Gold are wonderful drinking, esp the latter.
Serendipitous! Was about to go purchase it. Apparently available at Costco in TX. Then realized liquor stores closed in Sunday in TX. Will take care of it next week.
Only one question. I could swear it is Nicaraguan. Who cares really. Both countries had "drug" problems in the past. If both migrated to Rum brewing, that's good sign
Even with water the peaty whiskies are too much for most. I sometimes add a drop to a whole bottle of something more Highlandy.
Yeah, I guess. "Peaty" I get. "Burnt Smokey" I don't. In any event, if one is saddled with a bad whiskey and is not rich enough to pour it down the drain, then before totally murdering it Coke, first try Perrier. At least that way you are retaining most of the (awful) flavor.
PS - One guy I didn't know too well came over for a Party once. He put coke in McCallan 18 year old and drank it. Needless to say he knows he is not welcome in my house and I haven't heard of him since. Drink a good scotch or don't drink it. This is not about freedom. There simply have to be certain whiskey imbibing offenses punishable by law.
PS - One guy I didn't know too well came over for a Party once. He put coke in McCallan 18 year old and drank it. Needless to say he knows he is not welcome in my house and I haven't heard of him since. Drink a good scotch or don't drink it. This is not about freedom. There simply have to be certain whiskey imbibing offenses punishable by law.
Hmmmm ... I tend toward Oban, mostly because I've such fond memories of the town and like the "smallest of the distilleries" sort of story. Sadly, I'm so un sew fis tea cated that I can best enjoy Scotch (or Irish whiskey, which for a long time had a much greater cachet) if it's being hidden by honey and spices or a bit of soda.
Yeah, Oban is good. It's just that I'm on a quest to save money. So I've been doing a little more than "read behind the label" research into aging technique and process to identify "near identical" whiskey without having to pay for the "name brand". Don't have enough experience to find a good proxy for Oban.
FWIW, McCallan 12 year old used to be my Staple Highland. If you get the Ainsley Brae Sherry cask, it is pretty damn close. The McCallan best price on sale I've found is $40, and i have also seen it for as much as $55. The AB I've picked up for as low as $24 and never paid over $29. Mind you AB has a ton of variety. For instance they have a 49 year old - not a typo and I dunno HTF they can prove it - which sells for $500.
@rforno - Alcohol abuse. LOL !!! I really need to start a support group for these idiots.
It is complete waste of natural resources if you ask me. Good Whiskey regardless of which part of the world it is produced deserves respect. If you want to make a "cocktail" out of everything then try the colorless flavorless crap and add what you will to it.
As an aside, McCallan has a speyside, much lighter color. I am ashamed I didn't even know that. I also don't see price difference between the highland and the speyside. Will try to find the speyside.
Scotches are very commonly colored, even the famous. Not permitted w/ bourbon. The very pale scotches not so much.
I add things to them. Water, and sometimes drops of other whiskies.
'Burned wood' is a handy referent, but not (or not always) 'pleasant fall evening' but more 'old wet fireplace', or indeed electrical fire. 'Peaty' also includes iodine and merthiolate / mercurochrome ...
@davidrmoran hmmm....if you are making up your own "blend" formula from different single malts, maybe you can share your recipes. Perhaps multiple cheap single malts can produce a great blend.
Oh, sorry, nothing all that esoteric. I have always bought blends and tweaked them. At least for the 50y I have been drinking whiskies seriously. I am not a finicky single-m type. I love Macallans, most; Balvenies, all; Highland Parks, all; and Glenmorangies, most; and many others of the lighter-sweeter types. In other words no Obans, certainly no Frogs, few Lagavulins and Cragganmores. E.g., Dalmore Cigar, long gone, was one of the greats. Some of the Glen-f and -ls - are swell, I have not kept score.
But my goal generally is to get to something approximating the balance and Sprey / Highland sweetness and taste of Famous Grouse or perhaps Dewars and some Walkers. To that end, and believe me that these will be waaay declasse to the serious, I try and find the latest inexpensive low-cereal blends (meaning low in grain whiskies), this year meaning Cutty, Ballantine, and Duggan, and to them adding a drop or three of some acceptable bourbon (my cheap faves are Benchmark 8 and EW, less the menthol of JB White) and a drop or two only of some peatier / smokier blend. Maltier will do, though it is not the same thing, and that is another discussion. The leaders this decade of those are Grant's, Teacher's, White Horse, and JWRed. Esp the last is really good value.
Augment base to taste, then.
At the ideal level, it would be wonderful to blind-compare a really fine light blend like J&B mixed with a drop or two of Knob Creek and a drop of Oban (say), shake well, then taste against various Highland Parks, Glens, JW whatever other than Red, Macallans (which have a touch of sherry taste, so you could add a half-drop of Savory&James whatever), Balvenies, Glenmorangies, etc etc etc. For sure they will not taste close to the same. But the balance of sweetish and other complex flavors would be most instructive.
To those whose jaws are dropped about bourbon, know that scotch distilleries regularly buy US used bourbon barrels for further aging.
@davidrmoran. I always thought Famous Grouse was not that famous. I will give it a shot.
Regarding scotch whiskey being aged in US made oak barrels, I thought that was old news. Scotch simply means aged in Scotland. You might even be able to distill the whiskey in other parts of the world but if you bring it to Scotland and age it, then it is "scotch". To be able to call it scotch, it has to be aged a minimum of 3 years.
I'm not a big fan of bourbon, but then I am not a big fan of oak aged scotch either. So it's really about the oak and not about the bourbon.
? Did not say it was news. But typically it is not like using oak barrels in France, where they were never bourbon barrels. Bourbon barrels are charred inside, and that adds color and sweetness and complexity to scotch. Every scotch I know of has to some degree a ghost (or much more) of that roasted corn thing going on. I will have to poke around to see which (few) scotches are aged in uncharred oak. (All scotch is aged in oak barrels, by definition I think, so your nonfan statement is off.) Of course with all of these fancy port and sherry (etc.) finishes, there are additional flavor steps to take after the initial bourbon years. Three years, yes. It is amazing what some distillers achieve in that time. Old Smuggler, like Duggan's Dew, is an amazingly good drink, with some depth and complexity. Lots of other 3yo are awful, for mixing only (rob roys, e.g.). Oh yeah, Grouse (not black) is great, to my taste, and has a quite noticeable proportion of Highland Park in it, like Dewar's and Cardhu.
Oh, sorry, nothing all that esoteric. I have always bought blends and tweaked them. At least for the 50y I have been drinking whiskies seriously. I am not a finicky single-m type. I love Macallans, most; Balvenies, all; Highland Parks, all; and Glenmorangies, most; and many others of the lighter-sweeter types. In other words no Obans, certainly no Frogs, few Lagavulins and Cragganmores. E.g., Dalmore Cigar, long gone, was one of the greats. Some of the Glen-f and -ls - are swell, I have not kept score.
But my goal generally is to get to something approximating the balance and Sprey / Highland sweetness and taste of Famous Grouse or perhaps Dewars and some Walkers. To that end, and believe me that these will be waaay declasse to the serious, I try and find the latest inexpensive low-cereal blends (meaning low in grain whiskies), this year meaning Cutty, Ballantine, and Duggan, and to them adding a drop or three of some acceptable bourbon (my cheap faves are Benchmark 8 and EW, less the menthol of JB White) and a drop or two only of some peatier / smokier blend. Maltier will do, though it is not the same thing, and that is another discussion. The leaders this decade of those are Grant's, Teacher's, White Horse, and JWRed. Esp the last is really good value.
Augment base to taste, then.
At the ideal level, it would be wonderful to blind-compare a really fine light blend like J&B mixed with a drop or two of Knob Creek and a drop of Oban (say), shake well, then taste against various Highland Parks, Glens, JW whatever other than Red, Macallans (which have a touch of sherry taste, so you could add a half-drop of Savory&James whatever), Balvenies, Glenmorangies, etc etc etc. For sure they will not taste close to the same. But the balance of sweetish and other complex flavors would be most instructive.
To those whose jaws are dropped about bourbon, know that scotch distilleries regularly buy US used bourbon barrels for further aging.
I would put Oban in the totally unobjectionable category, with Macallan and Balvenie (love the doublewood, one of the best for value) I also love peat, Ardberg, Laphroaig, Lagavulin... But my starter whiskey for those who "think" they hate scotch is Oban. Mostly always successful especially for those whose drink of choice is quality bourbon.
Oops, oops, and d'oh, sorry, I agree and when I wrote about it, both plus and minus, I was thinking of Bowmore, another very good but altogether acquired taste (peaty). Oban is just fine in most ways.
Comments
Regards,
Ted
http://www.melandrose.com/istar.asp?a=6&id=92102&vfsku=3313470&vfsku=3313470&gpla=pla&gclid=Cj0KEQjwn_3GBRDc8rCnup-1x8wBEiQAdw3OAbVP3aQQVTu8KmzT2duuO_KxG4DPFQDKDomWUuXOwa4aAnUN8P8HAQ
la-FROYG. From Islay (eye-lah)
Definitely NOT a gateway Scotch.
To be candid, I'm a seasoned (wussy) Scotch drinker, and prefer the smoother stuff from Speyside and the Highlands.
It was way too peaty for me, with a medicinal bite...but, many would find that a good thing, and this bottle is highly acclaimed it appears.
WSKY
http://www.etf.com/sections/daily-etf-watch/etf-watch-whiskey-fund-launches
If Quarter Cask is to peaty try Dalmore... If you have had great investment success thus far go for the King Alexander III... If you have been mostly in bonds you might have to settle for the 12 year old.
As for the Laphroaig 10 Year Old Cask Strength: I am intentionally curious to experience the pointed peatiness of it. I do understand it's not an offering intended for neophytes. Soon..... Recently, I must say my experience with The Balvenie 10 Year was quite positive.
https://img.thewhiskyexchange.com/900/balob.10yov7.jpg
http://traveleatlove.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/clip_image002.jpg
Some of the private-label whiskys you can get from the Single Malt Whisky Society are amazing, and nearly all seem to be cask strength.
@PRESSmUP I have never even come across a Bushmill Single Malt. There are so many blended whiskeys which I generally stay away from. I drink mine neat, so frankly not a lot choice for me to chose from. With Soda/Water a lot of whiskey's become palatable. I will look for Bushmill single malt next time I'm in store.
@Ted Johnny Walker's is the big kahuna, but they make blends. Red Label is crap, Black Label is okay, Double Black is worth it, Green and Gold I haven't had, but Blue Label which is top of the line, if EXTREMELY good. I had two bottles. One I opened for my elder nephew's graduation, and the other I will open for my elder's graduation. They cost $150 for 750 ML, but I got them for about $100 a piece while on cruise.
@Amir I would definitely say I don't recall having a Speyside I haven't been able to drink neat. It is generally "safe" to buy Speyside. I just feel Highlands are superior because higher altitudes with lower air pressures do a better job of aging the whiskey as it "breathes" in and out of the wood.
An interesting side story I heard from a store manager, not sure if it's true. Cardhu - pronounced "car dow" - is the one of the base single malts for Johny Walker. There was a time, it went off the shelves and I couldn't find it for the longest time. Bottles of Cardhu were selling on eBay for a pretty penny (and if anyone buying food items on eBay they are just crazy). Apparently Cardhu tried to "up" their deal with Johny Walker and the latter simply bought off outstanding stock in the market to make sure Johny Walker Black - their best selling product - wouldn't suffer due to shortages. Not sure how things played out, but Cardhu then came back onto the market. After that I never tried Cardhu, just like after waiting for a mutual fund to open, I just found others...
@sma3 - Off Topic category was only created to talk about whiskey. I thought you knew that.
FWIW, I've stocked up on various Ainsley Brae's but have decided to give whiskey a break. Someone told me AGED Rum is very good and the good one's are as smooth and even indistinguishable from whiskey. Will report some day. Rum has to be cheaper and than whiskey, or I wouldn't pay up, but if it can be drunk neat, I will use the savings to DCA down into HSGFX.
https://www.drinkhacker.com/2009/03/10/review-ron-abuelo-anejo-rums/
JW Red is their peatiest blend except for Double Black, which is really strong. Most blends that have black in the name are like that (the 'new' Famous Grouse Black, e.g.). JW Green and Gold are wonderful drinking, esp the latter.
Only one question. I could swear it is Nicaraguan. Who cares really. Both countries had "drug" problems in the past. If both migrated to Rum brewing, that's good sign
PS - One guy I didn't know too well came over for a Party once. He put coke in McCallan 18 year old and drank it. Needless to say he knows he is not welcome in my house and I haven't heard of him since. Drink a good scotch or don't drink it. This is not about freedom. There simply have to be certain whiskey imbibing offenses punishable by law.
Oh ... my .... gods. That is alcohol abuse of the first degree -- VF, good action taken in response!!!
FWIW, McCallan 12 year old used to be my Staple Highland. If you get the Ainsley Brae Sherry cask, it is pretty damn close. The McCallan best price on sale I've found is $40, and i have also seen it for as much as $55. The AB I've picked up for as low as $24 and never paid over $29. Mind you AB has a ton of variety. For instance they have a 49 year old - not a typo and I dunno HTF they can prove it - which sells for $500.
It is complete waste of natural resources if you ask me. Good Whiskey regardless of which part of the world it is produced deserves respect. If you want to make a "cocktail" out of everything then try the colorless flavorless crap and add what you will to it.
As an aside, McCallan has a speyside, much lighter color. I am ashamed I didn't even know that. I also don't see price difference between the highland and the speyside. Will try to find the speyside.
I add things to them. Water, and sometimes drops of other whiskies.
'Burned wood' is a handy referent, but not (or not always) 'pleasant fall evening' but more 'old wet fireplace', or indeed electrical fire. 'Peaty' also includes iodine and merthiolate / mercurochrome ...
But my goal generally is to get to something approximating the balance and Sprey / Highland sweetness and taste of Famous Grouse or perhaps Dewars and some Walkers. To that end, and believe me that these will be waaay declasse to the serious, I try and find the latest inexpensive low-cereal blends (meaning low in grain whiskies), this year meaning Cutty, Ballantine, and Duggan, and to them adding a drop or three of some acceptable bourbon (my cheap faves are Benchmark 8 and EW, less the menthol of JB White) and a drop or two only of some peatier / smokier blend. Maltier will do, though it is not the same thing, and that is another discussion. The leaders this decade of those are Grant's, Teacher's, White Horse, and JWRed. Esp the last is really good value.
Augment base to taste, then.
At the ideal level, it would be wonderful to blind-compare a really fine light blend like J&B mixed with a drop or two of Knob Creek and a drop of Oban (say), shake well, then taste against various Highland Parks, Glens, JW whatever other than Red, Macallans (which have a touch of sherry taste, so you could add a half-drop of Savory&James whatever), Balvenies, Glenmorangies, etc etc etc. For sure they will not taste close to the same. But the balance of sweetish and other complex flavors would be most instructive.
To those whose jaws are dropped about bourbon, know that scotch distilleries regularly buy US used bourbon barrels for further aging.
Regarding scotch whiskey being aged in US made oak barrels, I thought that was old news. Scotch simply means aged in Scotland. You might even be able to distill the whiskey in other parts of the world but if you bring it to Scotland and age it, then it is "scotch". To be able to call it scotch, it has to be aged a minimum of 3 years.
I'm not a big fan of bourbon, but then I am not a big fan of oak aged scotch either. So it's really about the oak and not about the bourbon.
Did not say it was news.
But typically it is not like using oak barrels in France, where they were never bourbon barrels. Bourbon barrels are charred inside, and that adds color and sweetness and complexity to scotch. Every scotch I know of has to some degree a ghost (or much more) of that roasted corn thing going on.
I will have to poke around to see which (few) scotches are aged in uncharred oak. (All scotch is aged in oak barrels, by definition I think, so your nonfan statement is off.)
Of course with all of these fancy port and sherry (etc.) finishes, there are additional flavor steps to take after the initial bourbon years.
Three years, yes. It is amazing what some distillers achieve in that time. Old Smuggler, like Duggan's Dew, is an amazingly good drink, with some depth and complexity. Lots of other 3yo are awful, for mixing only (rob roys, e.g.).
Oh yeah, Grouse (not black) is great, to my taste, and has a quite noticeable proportion of Highland Park in it, like Dewar's and Cardhu.
I would put Oban in the totally unobjectionable category, with Macallan and Balvenie (love the doublewood, one of the best for value) I also love peat, Ardberg, Laphroaig, Lagavulin... But my starter whiskey for those who "think" they hate scotch is Oban. Mostly always successful especially for those whose drink of choice is quality bourbon.
Oban is just fine in most ways.