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both stock and/or balanced AND bond fund suggestions

Above all, having reached 65, I want to simplify, consolidate, simplify, re-deploy tax-sheltered stuff a bit at a time into non-sheltered investments and simplify, simplify, simplify. And keep it SIMPLE. Just in the last couple of days on this message board, I've read responses to my own questions and other links and articles which make me want to rip my own face off my head. NOTHING should be so complicated as the tax laws we have.

...So: I want to create a TAXABLE account in a good bond fund which pays more than the likes of PRSNX and DODIX. (I own the former, but not the latter. It's in a T-IRA.) I'm pretty happy with my PTIAX, (taxable account) but I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket. I'd love to get over a 4% yield, and prefer monthlies, not quarterlies. I have a MONTHLY few bills. The bills won't wait for my QUARTERLY pay-outs.

DODBX is a (balanced) prospect. I already own PRWCX in T-IRA.
What about Tweedy Browne, do you think?

Our income will be low enough so that we don't need to worry much about uncle sam and the IRS. But income will be high enough to live a good life here in the 50th State, even though EVERYTHING is expensive. We could not do it if my two maiden aunts didn't leave us a buncha money. But the money grew so well also due to the fine advice and direction I received and learned about HERE. Thanks.

The ins-and-outs of the tax code are totally bizarre. BULLSHIT is a word that comes to mind. "I'll just take mine straight, please. No chaser, either."

Anyone want to recommend a few of each for me? Bonds and balanced or pure stock funds? Thanks.

Comments

  • i own 12 balanced funds they are dodbx, hblix, jabax, jpvtx, lkbax, mbeax, msfrx, trxix, wbalx, ittax, mapox, vgwlx. in 2008 when the S&P dropped around 37%, my portfolio of balanced funds dropped around 22.8% which hurt. but it was better than an all stock fund portfolio. my thinking is that its impossible to time the market so you have to stay in it all the time but you should lower your risk by owning both stocks and bonds. im 56% stocks, 39% bonds, 4% cash according to fidelity.
  • I own 6 bond funds (words that I never ever expected to hear coming out of my mouth) but all in an Roth IRA to avoid paying taxes on the income generated by them. All have greater than 4% yields, 5 of them twice as much. (FWIW: IOFIX, BIT, PCI, PDI, PFN, PTY). I am not suggesting that you buy any of them, especially the CEF's.

    For your "taxable" account might you not fair better by looking at a muni bond fund or something like a dividend growth fund (e.g. VDIGX, but there are many others) where the income might be at least partly qualified and thus possibly sheltered from the tax man? I'm guessing that you 'need' the income in your taxable side and prefer not to draw down your IRA account(s).
  • edited December 2019
    Hi sir crash
    Please look at vanguard star vgstx (good balance fund) or vanguard prime cap core vppcx
    We have held these and add to them frequently for quite long time
    We have lsbrx Loomis bond fund, also happy w results
    We also have Akrex and FLAAX om our radar after reading few suggestions mentioned here frequently
  • Mark said:

    I own 6 bond funds (words that I never ever expected to hear coming out of my mouth) but all in an Roth IRA to avoid paying taxes on the income generated by them. All have greater than 4% yields, 5 of them twice as much. (FWIW: IOFIX, BIT, PCI, PDI, PFN, PTY). I am not suggesting that you buy any of them, especially the CEF's.

    For your "taxable" account might you not fair better by looking at a muni bond fund or something like a dividend growth fund (e.g. VDIGX, but there are many others) where the income might be at least partly qualified and thus possibly sheltered from the tax man? I'm guessing that you 'need' the income in your taxable side and prefer not to draw down your IRA account(s).

    Well, actually: I won't live forever. I have thought and thought, and waited and waited to pull the trigger on my T-IRA. Drawing-down the T-IRA just 3k or 4k each year actually gives me a 50-year window of time before it's all converted from tax-sheltered into whatever new taxable accounts I create. Wifey's agenda is NOT to stay Stateside after my demise. The more I put into a taxable account, the more she'll have readily available, without worrying about the arcane, convoluted tax rules. Whatever she inherits within a T-IRA, she'll have to wait until 59 and a half to get at it, without burning up a quick and instantaneous 10% tax penalty.

    This is do-able, and the more she has sitting in a taxable account, the better. At this point, we don't need to worry much about sheltering big profits and worrying about a sizable income. We've relocated to where we want to be for now. A dream come true, though we don't by any means live in a palace. Extended family is here to be of help, and they're great. Wifey will get a car, I won't even bother. 4 cars, in a single household. People are busy, just not ME. I can use my bus pass anytime to see ALL of Oahu, unlimited. I could circumnavigate Oahu on the bus every single day if I want! The senior yearly bus pass is less than one-twelfth of a standard annual pass. That's the difference between groceries or no groceries for over a month. Can you see me smiling from here?

  • Thanks, @JohnN. I just looked. GOOD prospects. Vanguard customer service is not the best, though, so I hear.... @Mark, is IOFIX not a niche-fund, doing backhanded things to generate its profit?
  • IOFIX is indeed a niche-fund. I would not however accuse them of doing things backhanded but rather just differently than all the others. I'm providing just the facts below, you can Google the heck out of it on your own. Numerous articles/opinions out there.

    IOFIX Fact Sheet
  • IOFAX high total return is due to the rising NAV of the fund. The fund managers set the NAV each closing according to “best practices”, not as an equity fund does according to the closing prices of assets held. I have never been clear on what the best practices are and why their legacy MBS are more valuable than those at SEMMX.
  • edited December 2019
    For a taxable account, I continue to recommend VTMFX.
    From Morningstar: “A balanced fund that seeks to distribute primarily tax-exempt income... essentially a combination of Vanguard Intermediate Tax-Exempt and Vanguard Tax-Managed Capital Appreciation.”
  • edited December 2019
    another vote for JABAX, else DSEEX + PONAX in whatever ratio lets you sleep best :)
  • edited December 2019
    Hi @Crash,

    My three hybrid type fund picks, from the growth and income area of my portfolio, would be AMECX, CAIBX and TIBAX. All three of these are good income generators plus they will grow your capital over time. From the income area of my portfolio my three hybrid type fund picks would be BAICX, FKINX and JNBAX. All three of these are good income generators however they have less equity risk associated with them and principal will not grow as fast when compared to those coming from the growth and income area.

    Remember ... members when signed in ... you can click on the fund's ticker symbol and select from a menu of fund reports to view.

    In addition ... I like @davidrmoran picks as well and I have been thinking of adding JABAX to the growth and income area of my portfolio. I already own PONAX in the income area of my portfolio.

    I wish all ... "Good Investing."

    Old_Skeet
  • edited December 2019
    Honestly honestly honestly, and yes, I know it’s the next level of complexity for most people above individual stocks even (let alone equity and bond mutual funds)—I think preferred stocks could be an answer for many people. Especially if needing monthly, or steady but not necessarily monthly, income.

    Yes many of the companies that issued these are not common stock SWAN investments, but keep in mind that preferred stock dividends HAVE to be paid before common stock dividends. So for many REITs and BDCs and CEFs and the like, it doesn’t matter how much their “common equity” dividend is, or how much it changes up or down, just that it IS paying a dividend, which these companies tend to do. And the preferred stock holder has to be paid before the common shareholders are paid (sorry for the repetition there).

    Some examples of monthly paying preferred stocks (you buy them just like individual stocks, from a broker....most now don’t charge a commission to buy or sell!):

    ARR-A: pays high 7% every month (a crappy mortgage REIT but just need it to continue to be a going concern to continue to pay)

    ECCB/OXLCO: low-to-mid 7% every month (the common, ECC and OXLC, own CLOs and other Wild West type investments, and definitely have fleas, but same as above)

    LANDP/GOODM/GAINM: all from companies managed by Gladstone something or other, and all pay 6% or better, monthly (similar parenthetical to ARR-A....though LAND is a farmland REIT, GOOD is a mixed property REIT, and GAIN is a BDC)

    VER-F: pays high 6% monthly (keeps getting partially called, so there is a chance your share counts would slowly decline as the company is able to have the cash available to partially redeem the issue; VER is a middling triple net REIT that was a poor company in a past life)

    Certainly these aren’t “can’t lose” investments, and there’s always chances that the issuing company goes belly up, and you have to deal with call risks, where the company buys the preferred shares back at par (generally $25), all of these are trading over $25 par price, and the prices definitely can fluctuate up and down a couple percent or more, based upon interest rate policies and market fears, but if you are interested in decent monthly income that you can count on during most economic times, preferreds are one solid option, in this posters humble opinion.

    I dont mean ti redirect the thread (and I realize this is MFO, not preferred stock observer lol), so PM me if any more interest. Definitely not an expert in all the nuances of these securities, but visit several sites dealing with them, and have traded them for a few years.:)
  • Just attempted: JABAX seems not to exist at the Janus Henderson website. Outside websites know of it and can instantly show me a quote. Hmmmmm. A less than desirable pay-back for my effort.
  • @Crash
    JABAX is an advisor/broker fund offering. The clue is an A, B or C before the X in the ticker, generally speaking, which has been used for load share classes of funds. This fund is now noted as a "T" type as part of the changes for fiduciary rules for advisors/brokers. I do believe your cup of tea will be found with JBALX.
    Skeet uses the JABAX due to his relationship and available choices with his broker, I will presume.
    You may discover all you want to know about T class with a search.
  • @catch22 Thanks for the reply. JBALX led me to yet more classes of shares. JBALX minimum is $100k. So, Janus Henderson simply doesn't want our money. As I'm fond of saying, nothing should be so complicated. I'll keep looking. There's no rush.
  • ....Just came across VLAAX. Looks good to me, except the ER is higher than it ought to be. In that category, I have liked and owned MAPOX, but I think we can do better than the performance that MAPOX has given us. What's not to like re: VLAAX? ($1,000 minimum to get in.)
  • edited January 2020
    @Crash
    Fidelity minimum is $500.
    Are you trying to buy this through your brokerage where your IRA or taxable accounts are held? Have you tried a test purchase there? OR is it stated at your brokerage that $100K is the minimum?
    There are a number of funds such as this that have similar long term results. Is there a particular reason you chose this fund?
  • No TF to buy the outstanding JABAX in my Fido account, so far as I can tell.
  • edited January 2020
    Hmmm, I have JABAX at Fidelity and is NTF. Also had it at Schwab for several years. Maybe the rules have changed since I added shares last year but you should try. It has done very well the last several years compared to other like funds. I just tried JABAX at Schwab as well and no problem there.

    https://cdn.janushenderson.com/webdocs/Fact+Sheet_Balanced+Fund+(Multi-Share)_3Q19_exp+01-15-20.pdf
  • IIRC, JABAX is NTF at Fidelity, Schwab,Vanguard and E-Trade. The minimum investment varies by brokerage.
  • Correction- JABAX has tf at Vanguard. I have a Vanguard account so I can buy funds like VWELX VWINX and VMVFX ntf .
  • Why recommend a Janus fund after their past scandals?
    JABAX is a good fund but FBALX is cheaper and out performs JABAX on a 10 Year basis.
  • @BigTom, I was remembering that, too: the past scandals. That's why I don't like to work with or invest with JPM, GS, WF, B of A, Citi and the other Big Bankster banks who screwed people leading up to and during the Crash of '08-'09. Janus' scandals go back further, I recall. To answer the question posed: As for brokerages, I've tried Firstrade and Fidelity, and the experiences were not wonderful. I still own all my funds directly with the mutual fund Houses. Performance Trust, TRP, and soon, we'll rollover wifey's 403b. So, it's deliberately not a great many different ones.
  • edited January 2020
    Deleted. Moved to a different thread.
  • @Crash, if you like TRP, why don't you open a brokerage account through them? Or do you have one already? If so, these funds may be bought through them just the same as an account with Fidelity or Schwab. I'm confused. In my opinion you have made it very hard on yourself trying to buy from individual houses.
  • BigTom said:

    Why recommend a Janus fund after their past scandals?
    JABAX is a good fund but FBALX is cheaper and outperforms JABAX on a 10 Year basis.


    Do a compare at MFOP, I suggest, looking at UI, maxxDD, GO status, etc....
  • several comments:
    1) I believe and can prove it that in most cases you want to own stock funds + bond funds because bond funds is where you find managers who can add performance + better risk attributes.

    2) Stocks are simpler, you must own US LC and VTI/VOO is just a great, very cheap and will beat most managed fund longer term. This index also gets over 40% of its revenues from abroad

    3) For about 20 years now my specialty has been to find the exceptions
    PRWCX-this is the only allocation fund I would use. The managers use a flexible mandate + use several categories + making the right decisions for many years and why performance is in the top 1-3% for 1-3-5-10-15 years.
    DSEEX-First, managers invest in global bonds then, they look at 11 US stock sectors and select 5 undervalued sectors, then take 4 sectors out of 5 with the best momentum. They don't invest directly in the index but in a derivative that is similar to the index.
    Basically, you get 200% investments for the price of 100%. You get real bonds + derivative of stock indexes.
    To make even simpler, let's assume they invest in just one sector SPY and assume the bond portion makes 3-4% annually. It means, the performance will be SPY + 3-4% - (paying for derivatives).
    USMV/SPLV-low volatility funds work. PV(link) shows that you get similar performance with better risk attributes

    4) For over 40 years high tech is where you will find the best opportunities and growth and now they own the world and this is the biggest category in the SP5500. So, why not just own QQQ which BTW gets over 50% of its revenue from abroad.

    5) If you want to diversify abroad I don't like generic indexes. I like to make a bet that EM is where I want to be but not in Europe.

    6) For bond funds, I have many great options and I mentioned many of them at my thread (https://www.mutualfundobserver.com/discuss/discussion/54803/bond-mutual-funds-analysis#latest)

    7) Don't collect funds, the max funds you own should be under 10 and your best ideas.

    Putting it all together and I can see VOO,PRWCX,DSEEX,QQQ + IISIX,VCFIX,IOFIX,PUCZX (you may need higher rated bond funds as ballast). Depending on goals I can make adjustments.
  • I like your comments @FD1000, especially this one:
    7) Don't collect funds, the max funds you own should be under 10 and your best ideas
    I don't know if <10 is the correct number or if it is 15 or even 20. But at some point you do dilute good managers or funds with not so good ones. And what typically goes with fund collecting is fund switching, translated, buy high and sell low. Just adding 2 more cents to what you said.

  • MikeM "I don't know if <10 is the correct number or if it is 15 or even 20. But at some point you do dilute good managers or funds with not so good ones. And what typically goes with fund collecting is fund switching, translated, buy high and sell low. Just adding 2 more cents to what you said."

    +1, more funds generally means more trades and more trades usually mean lower performance.
    1995-2000 I invested mostly in one fund, US total index after I read Random walk
    Since 2000 and after I started my best risk/reward funds, the max is 8 funds.
    In the last several years it's 5 but many times just 3-4 funds. There is no reason for me to own my second best ideas but I also trade more often than others by being invested most times at 99+% and playing momentum. I don't recommend or promote it for anybody.

    Over the years I helped many and I usually use 5-6 funds with 1-2 changes annually.

    For investors who really want to be buy and hold investors, I would recommend indexes and/or Wellington funds (VWIAX,VWENX,VWEAX) because who knows what will happen 10-20 years from now, the expense ratio is very low and these are unique conservative funds that are managed by a group and not star managers.
  • Just sent for literature from Value Line VLAAX Asset Allocation. I did some looking, and to my mind, it compares well with my PRWCX, which wifey cannot get into right now--- or anyone else, for that matter--- unless you already own shares. The ER on VLAAX is too high, but not outrageous: 1.07%.
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