IRS Will Pay Refunds During Government Shutdown, Official Says

Ted

FYI: The Internal Revenue Service will issue refunds to taxpayers even if the U.S. government shutdown extends into the filing season, a decision that may reduce political pressure on Congress and President Donald Trump to reach a deal to re-open the federal government.

“Tax refunds will go out,” the acting director of the White House Office of Management and Budget, Russell Vought, told reporters at a briefing on Monday.
Regards,
Ted
https://www.fa-mag.com/news/irs-will-pay-refunds-during-government-shutdown--official-says-42634.html?print

msf

"If people weren’t able to get refunds there would be "excruciating pressure" on lawmakers to cut a deal, said Mark Everson, a former IRS Commissioner."

And this would be a bad thing?

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2019/01/07/us/politics/ap-us-government-shutdown-tax-refunds.html
"The IRS said late Monday that it will recall a large number of furloughed employees to process returns. They will probably work without pay. "

Just what's needed to get those refunds checks out to you accurately, quickly.

I'm sure someone thought that forcing people to work without pay would turn out great. Especially regarding government money (IRS) and national security (TSA).

https://www.forbes.com/sites/grantmartin/2019/01/07/airport-security-lines-grow-across-the-nation-as-tsa-sickout-continues

johnN

does that mean we dont have to pay taxes if irs is shut down lol

msf

Apparently the tax collection part of the IRS was always deemed essential, so it was never going to be shut down. It was only the refund part that was considered superfluous.

davidrmoran

Too stupid to think ahead, or even know what to think ahead about:

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/01/trump-shutdown-government-did-not-know.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/07/us/florida-government-shutdown-marianna.html

Amazing tagline quote, amazing. Harm is a feature, not a side effect.

Mark

Not to worry David. According to individual #1 in the Florida article "It's mostly Democrats who aren't getting paid." Just think, if we would have had a legislative branch of government completely controlled by the Republicans the past two years along with a Republican president we would have that wall. Oh wait, never mind.

But meanwhile, I heard there's a sign at the local supermarket that it is not accepting food stamps due to the shutdown. Finally, the Republicans are denying food relief to the poor. They must be so proud of this moment.

hank

Trump’s paycheck to soybean farmers is being held up if they recently filed the paperwork. However, those (like one frequent poster I presume) who got their paperwork in before the shutdown will continue to get paid by Uncle Sam. It’s usually the little guy that gets hurt by these.
http://newschannel20.com/news/local/government-shutdown-affecting-payments-for-local-farmers

Feel bad for the TSA folks, air traffic controllers, NTSB teams, etc. Don’t know about most here, but for much of my working years I needed my twice monthly paycheck to cover mortgage, transportation, food etc. Not much left over at the end of a pay period. Yes, the 403B was accumulating, but it’s not easy to get your hands on the $$ if you’re under the required age, So any talk about these folks “making adjustments” is nonsense.

JoJo26

Air Traffic Controllers... They make really good money... Should not have to live paycheck to paycheck.

Ted

@hank: Go to the head of the class !
Regards,
Ted

Mark

@JoJo - and yet there they are. Do you have some particular insight into how air traffic controllers spend/budget their paychecks?

JoJo26

@Mark. ATCs make $80k+ at entry-level positions and on average earn more than $125k. I'm sorry, but that is plenty to live comfortably AND save. If they're living paycheck to paycheck there is a major spending problem.

Mark

@JoJo -
The median annual wage for air traffic controllers was $124,540 in May 2017. The median wage is the wage at which half the workers in an occupation earned more than that amount and half earned less. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $67,440, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $175,800.Apr 30, 2018
Air Traffic Controllers - Bureau of Labor Statistics
https://www.bls.gov/ooh/transportation-and-material.../air-traffic-controllers.htm

None of this of course tells us what their debt obligations are along with their cost of living based on location, medical bills, student loans, etc., etc., etc.. One should be careful with blanket statements. FWIW I'm related to one.

davidrmoran

jeez louise, an awful lot of thrifty, frugal, prudent, MFO-approved saver types make $70k, or even $85k, and live paycheck to paycheck, and barely so

johnN

think Ted probably yield 2 - 3 mills annually just from Div income...lol

JoJo26

davidrmoran said:

jeez louise, an awful lot of thrifty, frugal, prudent, MFO-approved saver types make $70k, or even $85k, and live paycheck to paycheck, and barely so

That's just poor budgeting then... Even at $70k, one should not have to live paycheck to paycheck unless he/she 1) has way too much debt (maybe should've bought a more modest house and pay full balances on credit cards) and/or 2) living well outside his/her means.

The truth hurts.

davidrmoran

love to be fingerwagged by someone ignorant, who clearly does not know how much housing costs in expensive places. Truth hurts, bwahaha. Oh, right, move elsewhere, or do 3-4h of commuting every day.

hank

Not to belabor this - but I retired more than 20 years ago making $70,000 at the time (1998).

I was maxing out my 403B, which was automatically deducted by employer. Where I worked we also contributed a sizable amount each pay to the employer sponsored defined benefit plan. I paid extra having opted for the most expensive (but better) plan. Seems to me I also paid extra for the best health plan available to employees. State and Federal taxes hit me hard. Also, mandatory Social Security. And monthly dues to our professional association were deducted. After all that I was lucky to see 50% of my gross pay.

Still had a house payment (downsized after retiring) and a payment on a new pickup truck. Where I worked (Detroit area) vehicle insurance rates were high to start with and even higher if you drove over 10 miles each way to work. No credit card debt or consumer loans. Lived pretty well (fitness center, trips to Florida, etc.) Probably had enough in non-retirement savings to last a month. After that would have had to start running up a credit line to stay afloat.

Just me. Others may have developed better thrift habits or might have had family members to help tide them over.

Mark

Again with the blanket statements JoJo. I think that you're making a lot of presumptions that may not be so. Just as not everyone lives an unattainable lifestyle so to do they not have perfectly manicured finances. Do you know what full time nursing home care costs? Have you seen the cost for some everyday medications lately? Do you have any idea what an apartment/home, even modest ones, in Seattle, San Francisco, or New York run? I have no idea what any of these people's budgets are like but I'm willing to bet that most are not as irresponsible as you seem to be making them out to be.

JoJo26

Mark said:

Again with the blanket statements JoJo. I think that you're making a lot of presumptions that may not be so. Just as not everyone lives an unattainable lifestyle so to do they not have perfectly manicured finances. Do you know what full time nursing home care costs? Have you seen the cost for some everyday medications lately? Do you have any idea what an apartment/home, even modest ones, in Seattle, San Francisco, or New York run? I have no idea what any of these people's budgets are like but I'm willing to bet that most are not as irresponsible as you seem to be making them out to be.

@Mark,

I do entirely understand the cost of living variations across the states, however, if you can't afford to live there, you can't afford to live there. It's pretty simple. Smart finances would recommend your rent/mortgage being anywhere near 50% of your pay. If that's what it's going to be then you better move and live a better life elsewhere, even if your "pay" is less.

Agree to disagree about the irresponsibility. If I had to venture a guess, I'd say 70% of people live outside of their means. No, I don't have any data to prove that and don't care. I'll leave it at that.

Mark

Of course. Why accept the truth when it's so much easier just to blow it off. Good talk.

davidrmoran

His truth, that is. This from someone who 'entirely understands CoL variations' ....

Maybe he does not have kids, at least not ones who work in the nonprofit sector.

'If you can't afford to live there ...' --- or maybe he does not know any cops or firefighters or teachers who might prefer to live in or near the communities they serve.

Whatev. Who ever denied that lots live outside their means? Not what we're talking about.

This universal problem of never ever saying 'oops, oh, yeah, I guess I overstated, my bad, sorry' just gets worse and worse.

JoJo26

davidrmoran said:

Whatev. Who ever denied that lots live outside their means? Not what we're talking about. .

Had to get back in on this. It is all connected so it is what we are talking about. If you're living paycheck to paycheck on $100k, you are living outside of your means. How can you possibly deny that? There are plenty of people that get by on half that. Maybe you shouldn't have a $500k home and Tesla.

Mark

You're absolutely right JoJo. You picked out arguably the highest paid profession in the list of 800,000 government employees, comprising 1.88% of those affected to try and make your point and nailed it. Now that you've vilified those scumbags what of the other 98+%? While you're working on that we'll make arrangements for all them air traffic controllers to move to more affordable locations. All them fancy cities with their high costs of living don't need air traffic controller employees anyway.

hank

JoJo26 said:

If you're living paycheck to paycheck on $100k, you are living outside of your means. How can you possibly deny that?

So the government shutdown and payless paydays signify God’s Wrath inflicted upon those who haven’t practiced sound financial management?

(Never mind the 800+ credit scores, home ownership or substantial tax-sheltered retirement accounts these folks may have garnered over a lifetime of work. They should have anticipated this monster.)

Mark said:

You're absolutely right JoJo. You picked out arguably the highest paid profession in the list of 800,000 government employees, comprising 1.88% of those affected ...

Just hope you’re not being guided into LGA some rainy windy night by one of those unpaid, stressed-out and hungry ATCs ...

JoJo26

Mark said:

You're absolutely right JoJo. You picked out arguably the highest paid profession in the list of 800,000 government employees, comprising 1.88% of those affected to try and make your point and nailed it. Now that you've vilified those scumbags what of the other 98+%? While you're working on that we'll make arrangements for all them air traffic controllers to move to more affordable locations. All them fancy cities with their high costs of living don't need air traffic controller employees anyway.

SMMFH. And you think millenials are entitled...

davidrmoran

You are the master of strawman construction! Tesla, bwahaha. I will tell my daughter what she's doing wrong.

JoJo26

You do that.

hank

On another front ... Why are these people continuing to show up for work if they’re not being paid?

Only in Trumpworld... ?

Mark

Hope.
Dedication.
Fear of being fired or otherwise losing their jobs.
None of which individual #1 knows or cares about.

Old_Joe

I think it's incredibly unfair of you folks to expect Jo-Jo to present an accurate, well-reasoned and fairly balanced presentation. If Individual #1 isn't required to do that, why pick on one of his acolytes?

Ted

@MFO Members: Its hard being #1, but someone has to do it !
Regards,
Ted