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Here's a statement of the obvious: The opinions expressed here are those of the participants, not those of the Mutual Fund Observer. We cannot vouch for the accuracy or appropriateness of any of it, though we do encourage civility and good humor.

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Sentiment & market Indicators

SENTIMENT & MARKET INDICATORS, 11/19/25
AAII Bull-Bear Spread -11.0% (below average)
CNN Fear & Greed Index 11 (extreme fear)
NYSE %Above 50-dMA 34.41% (negative)
SP500 %Above 50-dMA 36.40% (negative)
These are contrarian indicators.

INVESTOR CONCERNS: Budget, debt, tariffs, inflation, jobs, Fed, dollar, recession, geopolitical, Russia-Ukraine (194+ weeks), Israel-Hamas (67+27 weeks; fragile peace).
For the Survey week (Th-Wed), stocks down, bonds down, oil up, gold down, dollar up.

It will take time to fully restart US Government. Losses for hourly federal workers are permanent. Late gov reports: jobs, Nov 20 (today); PPI, Nov 25. There are more exceptions to tariffs on food items & more trade deals are coming.
#AAII #CNN #Sentiment
https://ybbpersonalfinance.proboards.com/post/2308/thread

Comments

  • @yogibearbull

    Always appreciate the contribution. Particularly so concise.
  • VIX has crept up to 25!
  • stayCalm said:

    VIX has crept up to 25!

    Nice. I have a bit in TAIL. Up 1% at the moment. Wow. Did the markets turn on a dime today. We’ll see if it lasts.
  • edited November 20
    My assumption is that a whole lot of folks saw the opportunity to exit positions. I was considering lightning up on equities.
  • @hank: Wow. Did the markets turn on a dime today. We’ll see if it lasts.

    Um....the markets are in a bipolar state, tending toward nonsense. Stunning shift in attitude today.
  • edited November 20

    @hank: Wow. Did the markets turn on a dime today. We’ll see if it lasts.

    Um....the markets are in a bipolar state, tending toward nonsense. Stunning shift in attitude today.

    Agree. And I think it’s overly-simplistic and non-productive as an investor to attribute market behavior to any single individual whether you love or loath him. Honestly, is this how people invest today? Based on their view of the political leadership?

    My sense is many markets have been expensive (the nice term for overvalued) for many years (and still are). Depending on one’s time horizon it may or may not be appropriate to own various assets. But to attribute everything to a single individual or party? No. Neither Democrats nor Republicans have control of the economy. Why pretend one party does? Herbert Hoover did not cause the Great Depression and Franklin Roosevelt did not end it (but ramping up for war in Europe had a lot to do with ending it.) Economies have a mind of their own.

    End of rant.
  • hank said:

    @hank: Wow. Did the markets turn on a dime today. We’ll see if it lasts.

    Um....the markets are in a bipolar state, tending toward nonsense. Stunning shift in attitude today.

    Agree. And I think it’s overly-simplistic and non-productive as an investor to attribute market behavior to any single individual whether you love or loath him. Honestly, is this how people invest today? Based on their view of the political leadership?

    My sense is many markets have been expensive (the nice term for overvalued) for many years (and still are). Depending on one’s time horizon it may or may not be appropriate to own various assets. But to attribute everything to a single individual or party? No. Neither Democrats nor Republicans have control of the economy. Why pretend one party does? Herbert Hoover did not cause the Great Depression and Franklin Roosevelt did not end it (but ramping up for war in Europe had a lot to do with ending it.) Economies have a mind of their own.

    End of rant.
    Post of the year @Hank. Thanks for your cogent comments.
  • I Second that motion!
  • edited November 20
    One individual or party does not control the long arc but most certainly can influence the short arc. For example Democrat policies on solar, renewables, EV credits does influence consumer and market behavior.

    Republican policies around ACA, EPA, TCJA, tariffs, control of Federal Reserve do affect consumer and market behavior.

    Elections have consequences that last a lot longer than a 4 year Presidential term -- life appointments of judges, long tenured Fed Governors, etc..
  • stayCalm said:



    Elections have consequences that last a lot longer than a 4 year Presidential term -- life appointments of judges, long tenured Fed Governors, etc..

    Let's add to that the isolationist policy that is straining the United States' international trade partnerships. It will take time to rebuild these. I don't see how this can be ignored.

    The resilient US consumer has been willing to spend for so long. But now the job market has seized up and policies (i.e. tariffs) may be hurting the economy instead of helping. Bringing back manufacturing jobs was never going to be a difference maker. Add furloughed and terminated govt workers to the mix and continued inflation.

    Agreed, there are consequences to these actions. Average people are feeling some economic pain. Perception is everything - do the majority of Americans believe in the current administration's ability to navigate these waters?
  • @hank: ...Economies have a mind of their own...End of rant.

    A very pragmatic rant, if indeed it was a rant.

    Even though I detest the orange buffoon and his unqualified knee-scraping appointees, I agree there is no obvious connection between his corrupt/inane actions and the current market (just like Biden's senility had nothing to do with the market's exuberance during 2023/2024), but I don't agree that his administration hasn't affected the economy. DOGE? Tariffs? The Big Stupid Bill (otherwise known as Project 2025)? ACA dismissal?

    We are due for a significant correction regarding this "expensive" market, but there is too much extraneous bullshit and insider shenanigans within this unchecked executive branch to ignore how it may affect future market/economy confidence. I'm sure to get some grumbles for this, but egotistical billionaires shouldn't be involved in any government oversight, imho. Thanks for the nonsense, voters!

    (I must admit that last weekend's 60 Minutes episode on obvious gov corruption within this admin really pissed me off. There's a new impeachable offense every damn week)
  • Some crazy bearish numbers out there from AAII to the CNN Fear and Greed Index. Saw where yesterday the $SPY Put Volume jumped to its second highest on record surpassed only by April 4 of this year. Probably explains today’s rally.
  • edited November 21
    I agree that Trump's policies are not responsible for day-to-day market gyrations. Except maybe in a very broad sense. And I agree that his policies are likely to be long-term destructive to confidence. And long-term destructive to the consumer. And I believe that it may be impossible to separate the wheat from the chaff in this regard. Basically, I think that everybody above is correct, one way or another.
  • edited November 23
    Charlie Bilello and Peter Mallouk from Creative Planning discuss the divergence
    between consumer sentiment and market performance.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkjeXuSf6D4
  • Thank you. This excerpt id from one of the comment below.
    This is also why public trust in government is at an ATL. Trust is directly correlated with how honest and trustworthy the government is
    ATL = all time low
  • Junkster said:

    Some crazy bearish numbers out there from AAII to the CNN Fear and Greed Index. Saw where yesterday the $SPY Put Volume jumped to its second highest on record surpassed only by April 4 of this year. Probably explains today’s rally.

    After the buy signal mentioned above on November 20 we got another one the very following day on the 21st. According to Subu Trade we had a huge spike in $SPXU (3x inverse SPX). This spike was on par with past bottoms such as the Covid bottom, the October 2022 bear market bottom, and the April Liberation Day bottom. So we shall see how these two contrarian signals of investor sentiment fares this time around.
  • edited November 24
    SENTIMENT & MARKET INDICATORS, 11/19/25
    AAII Bull-Bear Spread -11.0% (below average)
    CNN Fear & Greed Index 11 (extreme fear)
    NYSE %Above 50-dMA 34.41% (negative)
    SP500 %Above 50-dMA 36.40% (negative)
    These are contrarian indicators.
    Good information, but the above indicators are not accurate about how markets are likely to react over the next 1, 4, or 16 weeks.
  • edited 7:39AM
    Seems to me that one particular person is responsible for whatever effect massive new tariffs are having on people and the economy. Unlike manias and crashes, these tariffs are not an expected by-product of whatever anyone imagines a "normal" market cycle consists of.

    Every time I read the business page I see articles about how owners/managers in various lines of business are adjusting their plans due to the singular actions of one particular person. But investors are supposed to ignore that information because it's only politics, when it obviously is not politics but a number of exogenous economic events still working their way through the economy? One might as well go down to the beach and argue with the tide.

    How about the always entertaining Quote Investigator on Keynes, and what to do when facts change:

    The inactive investor who takes up an obstinate attitude about his holdings and refuses to change his opinion merely because facts and circumstances have changed is the one who in the long run comes to grievous loss.
    To be "fair," neither political party previously showed much interest in voting for tariffs since the Smoot-Hawley disaster for the R's and The Tariff of Abominations for the D's.
  • The very unusual situation of poor sentiments and indicators near market highs has been noted in the media and at MFO. The K-economy explanation sounds reasonable.

    AAII Sentiment is survey based (and so is the UM sentiment - not included here), but other indicators are measurement based and that is concerning.

    How to use this information depends on the readers. It has been tracked here and elsewhere for years - every Thursday morning like clockwork!

    Personally, I don't sell when sentiments and indicators are very negative. I don't time and always have market exposure suitable for my comfortable sleep level.

    As a corollary, I won't buy when sentiments and indicators are very positive.

    Should one buy here? There seem selected opportunities - lots of stuff is lagging in this narrowly led market. But beware that the lagging stuff would also be hit hard in any market selloff.
  • Should one buy here? There seem selected opportunities - lots of stuff is lagging in this narrowly led market. But beware that the lagging stuff would also be hit hard in any market selloff.

    I keep telling myself that.

    Recent purchases of equity funds in the IRA aren't much more than bookmarks. Some of the deck chairs in the taxable have been rearranged, but no new money is involved.

  • edited 10:40AM
    ”Should one buy here? There seem selected opportunities - lots of stuff is lagging in this narrowly led market. But beware that the lagging stuff would also be hit hard in any market selloff.”

    All true.

    I’m leary of markets overall (especially high-flying tech). Continue to hold small 1X shorts on the S&P and Dow which dampens daily volatility. Shorting the QQQ would be too risky IMHO. I think there’s opportunity in some of the really beaten up stuff in the mid or small cap area, left behind by the momentum chasers. Own small slices of 12 such stocks. Most were down 30-50% over the past year when I bought. They’ve dipped and then gotten back above break-even in the few weeks since picking up most. You really need to close your eyes if holding this stuff - and spread the risk around. Also, buy in over time, not all at once.
  • For now we stay patient and let cash build. Better entry points will prevail in this market.
  • The very unusual situation of poor sentiments and indicators near market highs has been noted in the media and at MFO. The K-economy explanation sounds reasonable.

    ... I don't time and always have market exposure suitable for my comfortable sleep level.

    As a corollary, I won't buy when sentiments and indicators are very positive.

    Should one buy here? There seem selected opportunities - lots of stuff is lagging in this narrowly led market. But beware that the lagging stuff would also be hit hard in any market selloff.

    At present my "comfortable" level is far lower than it has been for a very long time.

    I agree that even "defensive" equity positions are likely to get hit. Perhaps, not as bad as the high flyers. Best to be cautious, and wait for better entry points.

    I am unloading my smallish foreign equity position today. It seems like a good starting point to raise a little more dry powder. I am also thinking about locking in gains in my tech funds (Roth/TIRA). Maybe my growth funds, next.

    Should I be worried that funds I own, which are up 117% since jan 1, 2023, might go up a little more? Nah. The thought of buying them back at steep discounts is a bit thrilling though.


  • WABAC said:

    Seems to me that one particular person is responsible for whatever effect massive new tariffs are having on people and the economy. Unlike manias and crashes, these tariffs are not an expected by-product of whatever anyone imagines a "normal" market cycle consists of.

    ...

    Biden?

    Unless it miraculously works out.

  • edited 1:38PM

    The very unusual situation of poor sentiments and indicators near market highs has been noted in the media and at MFO. The K-economy explanation sounds reasonable.

    AAII Sentiment is survey based (and so is the UM sentiment - not included here), but other indicators are measurement based and that is concerning.

    How to use this information depends on the readers. It has been tracked here and elsewhere for years - every Thursday morning like clockwork!

    Personally, I don't sell when sentiments and indicators are very negative. I don't time and always have market exposure suitable for my comfortable sleep level.

    As a corollary, I won't buy when sentiments and indicators are very positive.

    Should one buy here? There seem selected opportunities - lots of stuff is lagging in this narrowly led market. But beware that the lagging stuff would also be hit hard in any market selloff.

    @yogobearbull. Keep posting here. Your sentiment posts are appreciated. We just saw what occurs when sentiment gets near bearish extremes and in some sentiment indicators near all time historical extremes.
  • US trading should be light this week as the holidays come into focus. The bull keeps its hold over bears (of which there are too many, perhaps?) and the turkey takes center stage.

    Gobble gobble.
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