Here's a statement of the obvious: The opinions expressed here are those of the participants, not those of the Mutual Fund Observer. We cannot vouch for the accuracy or appropriateness of any of it, though we do encourage civility and good humor.
Any investors hoping to find a Diversified Bonds fund could think about starting with T. Rowe Price Global Multi-Sector Bond Investor (PRSNX). PRSNX carries a Zacks Mutual Fund Rank of 3 (Hold), which is based on nine forecasting factors like size, cost, and past performance.
I'm 2 months short of 4 years since I got into PRSNX. I got nothing but love for that fund. It's held up nicely in terms of share value. TRP tells me I'm down YTD by just a quarter percent. That's -.25%. I've added a big bunch to it a couple of months ago. INCOME for the duration: $2,126.68. SHARE VALUE has sunk by a mere -$187.73. Actual, hard-dollar figures. The TRP performance number, tailored to my own account, tells me that over the past THREE (3) years, it's up +4.16%. No complaints.
Hi sir get out stocks while u can like Ted if retired ready... if I was 65 yo would be sitting on large piles of bonds right now and laughing while collectingmonthly Divs
Many folks lost more than 55% in their portfolios?
They must have had some really creative portfolios, because I can only find around 110 funds that lost that much in 2008, and a sizeable portion of those are ProFunds and Rydex leveraged funds. Were that many folks riding these funds all the way down, especially with the 2000 market still in the rear view mirror?
Admittedly, M*'s list is the result of survivorship bias. Still, there just weren't that many mainstream funds that lost that much. The one exception seems to be EM funds, though they're not likely to have constituted a major portion of many folks' portfolios.
That's not to say that some people didn't see their portfolios drop by a lot.
Many folks lost more than 55% in their portfolios? ... They must have had some really creative portfolios, because I can only find around 110 funds that lost that much in 2008 ...
Maybe they had it all in Oppenheimer’s Champion Income Fund? (Sounds safe enough.)
“Oppenheimer's Core Bond fund -- presumably suited to serve as an investor's core bond holding -- lost nearly 36 percent last year (2008). But that return looks stellar compared to their high yield Champion Income fund, which was off more than 78 percent.”
That was, of course, a junk bond fund. But many had been lulled into thinking high yield bonds were relatively safe compared to equities. Why they believed that? I don’t know.
@johnN again is talking nonsense through his scared hat --- time to recover for TWEIX was ~<20mo, plus or minus, and for DODGX, FCNTX, PRWCX, PRBLX, FLPSX the same or less. Interesting to graph. That is hardly even buy and hold, so just hang in.
But this is in hindsight. Of course a sharp drop and bad headlines concern all of us. Dow went from ~12k summer 08, less than half what it is now, to half of that by March 09,
Still.
If you really lack faith, you oughtta not invest and probably should not be publicly on this site, fretting away.
That fund (OPCHX) no longer exists. A search (as I did) of current funds that did badly a decade ago will miss the ones that died off.
But another issue with that particular fund is that it was heavily leveraged. Again I question the wisdom (sanity?) of anyone who rode a leveraged fund all the way down in 2008.
Though in fairness to the poor suckers investors stuck with this fund,
The 2008 prospectus for the Champion fund didn’t adequately disclose the fund’s practice of assuming substantial leverage in using derivative instruments. ...
The SEC’s investigation found that the Champion fund’s 2008 prospectus was materially misleading in describing the fund’s “main” investments in high-yield bonds without adequately disclosing the fund’s practice of assuming substantial leverage on top of those investments. While the prospectus disclosed that the fund “invested” in “swaps” and other derivatives “to try to enhance income or to try to manage investment risk,” it did not adequately disclose that the fund could use derivatives to such an extent that the fund’s total investment exposure could far exceed the value of its portfolio securities and, therefore, that its investment returns could depend primarily upon the performance of bonds that it did not own.
@davidrmoran etal I did a quick chart of the funds you noted. I'll leave the link fully visible to view the fund tickers there, too.
As many equity fund sectors were at "highs" near Halloween, 2007, this is the start point for the chart; and the end point at May, 2010 is when some of the funds in this chart were attempting to obtain a break even point from Oct. 31, 2007. Also, May, 2010 is the beginning of a somewhat sideways/rough period, as Europe was still in deep poop with Greece and other countries.
NOTE: the market bottom lows (%) indicated around March 6, 2009 are not for the year, 2008; but relative from the chart start date. EXAMPLE: FCNTX reported a year 2008 loss of -37.2%.
Lastly, for those inclined; the M* expanded view at the performance TAB still shows the 2008 return for a particular fund. The 2008 returns will leave the 10 year chart soon. Say good night, Catch. Good night
Huh? There was broad and slight decline before 9/08, sure, but Monday 9/15/08 is the point of the gulping, newsmaking drop. Some of us remember it vividly.
For SP500, breakeven was achieved toward the end of 4/10, as I said. ~20mo.
Further breakeven selling opps presented a half-year later, and since then, well, mostly rock'n'roll.
Comments
Really?; and WHY???
And which type of bonds ???
What indicates to you that the financial markets are about to blow up to worthless ???
They must have had some really creative portfolios, because I can only find around 110 funds that lost that much in 2008, and a sizeable portion of those are ProFunds and Rydex leveraged funds. Were that many folks riding these funds all the way down, especially with the 2000 market still in the rear view mirror?
Admittedly, M*'s list is the result of survivorship bias. Still, there just weren't that many mainstream funds that lost that much. The one exception seems to be EM funds, though they're not likely to have constituted a major portion of many folks' portfolios.
That's not to say that some people didn't see their portfolios drop by a lot.
“Oppenheimer's Core Bond fund -- presumably suited to serve as an investor's core bond holding -- lost nearly 36 percent last year (2008). But that return looks stellar compared to their high yield Champion Income fund, which was off more than 78 percent.”
That was, of course, a junk bond fund. But many had been lulled into thinking high yield bonds were relatively safe compared to equities. Why they believed that? I don’t know.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-37640185/oppenheimers-bond-fund-blowup-worse-than-you-think/
@johnN again is talking nonsense through his scared hat --- time to recover for TWEIX was ~<20mo, plus or minus, and for DODGX, FCNTX, PRWCX, PRBLX, FLPSX the same or less. Interesting to graph. That is hardly even buy and hold, so just hang in.
But this is in hindsight. Of course a sharp drop and bad headlines concern all of us. Dow went from ~12k summer 08, less than half what it is now, to half of that by March 09,
Still.
If you really lack faith, you oughtta not invest and probably should not be publicly on this site, fretting away.
But another issue with that particular fund is that it was heavily leveraged. Again I question the wisdom (sanity?) of anyone who rode a leveraged fund all the way down in 2008.
Though in fairness to the poor
suckersinvestors stuck with this fund, Hence a $35M settlement payment to the SEC.https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2012-2012-110htm
More important for the investors was a $52.5M payment to settle the investors' class action suit.
https://www.labaton.com/cases/oppenheimer-champion
I did a quick chart of the funds you noted. I'll leave the link fully visible to view the fund tickers there, too.
As many equity fund sectors were at "highs" near Halloween, 2007, this is the start point for the chart; and the end point at May, 2010 is when some of the funds in this chart were attempting to obtain a break even point from Oct. 31, 2007. Also, May, 2010 is the beginning of a somewhat sideways/rough period, as Europe was still in deep poop with Greece and other countries.
https://stockcharts.com/freecharts/perf.php?TWEIX,DODGX,FCNTX,PRWCX,PRBLX,FLPSX&l=2220&r=2849&O=011000
NOTE: the market bottom lows (%) indicated around March 6, 2009 are not for the year, 2008; but relative from the chart start date. EXAMPLE: FCNTX reported a year 2008 loss of -37.2%.
Lastly, for those inclined; the M* expanded view at the performance TAB still shows the 2008 return for a particular fund. The 2008 returns will leave the 10 year chart soon.
Say good night, Catch.
Good night
For SP500, breakeven was achieved toward the end of 4/10, as I said. ~20mo.
Further breakeven selling opps presented a half-year later, and since then, well, mostly rock'n'roll.
I suggest using M* 10k-growth charting, always.