Here's a statement of the obvious: The opinions expressed here are those of the participants, not those of the Mutual Fund Observer. We cannot vouch for the accuracy or appropriateness of any of it, though we do encourage civility and good humor.
“When you buy a car, you pay a sales tax of 6 to 8 percent, depending on where you live in Pennsylvania. That's $1,200 to $1,600 for a $20,000 car."
In CT (where I live) not only does the first buyer of a new car pay sales tax on the full price of this new car, but subsequent buyers of this car pay a used car sales tax as part of re-registeration. This equates to double, triple, even quadrulple taxation on a car sold multiple times... Now that progressive taxation!
ARRISBURG — A Democratic candidate for governor on Tuesday proposed a temporary tax on the sale of stocks and bonds to generate money to reduce Pennsylvania's $49 billion liability for state and school retirees' pension funds. Suggest that the tax apply to teachers & state employees only , as they would be the ones to benefit. As , its only temporary, would that be 1 year or 100 ?!
Howdy Derf, 'Course, wondering what the historical record of a "temporary" tax that lasts forever....yes, indeed. So, would this gubiner candidate try to tax into/inside the 403b's and related? Ya, right. I sure would like to ask him a direct question as to how this tax would be processed. His bio indicates that he is and has been a hard working and giving/caring person; but I think he flew off the political rail with this one. Hey, you're right...........too darn cold in MI. -1 right now and go'in to -8 or so tonight. Has been cold enough for too long..... the kind of cold that causes the house to have growls and noises of popping into the night. Take care, Catch
Reply to @bee: When I trade/sell a car, I get a sales tax amount credited to me equal to the value of the sale as part of the transaction. The subsequent buyer does pay the full sales tax on the price of the car however it is not double or triple taxation as I did get part of that tax back.
"Asked how he thinks he could, if elected, get lawmakers to approve a plan in what is a Republican-controlled General Assembly, Myers said it's “a good question,” adding that seniors and others would demand it as the public increasingly becomes aware of the state's pension crisis. "
It's Pennsylvania! So, with respect to taxes, the devil is in the details. I used to work a few miles south of Pennsylvania in MD. 20% or more of the people who retired from my workplace who wanted to stay in the area moved across the border to Pennsylvania. They said that retirees pay little to NO income tax. This is true of 401K type withdrawals after a certain age. So, to the extent that people's savings is considered "retirement" money, they probably won't pay income tax. I used to tease them saying that once the boomers retired, those Pennsylvania tax exemptions on old people would vaporize. I still think they will at some point.
Reply to @bee: "... equates to double, triple, even quadrulple taxation on a car sold multiple times..." They're gonna like the new aluminum F150 than. (-:
Reply to @Dennis1: I've bought and sold many cars...never received a tax credit...did I miss that? Can I now claim it as a donation to a non- profit?
The new motor vehicle taxes will be monitored and reported directly to taxing agencies from the car itself (smart cars)...mileage use tax, excess speed tax, excessive idling tax, Fast Food drive-in restaurant tax, Urban Bass Noise reduction tax...just a few we can look forward to.
How dumb is this idea? So typical that someone who has no clue how the economy and business work would believe this will help anything. It is a real dis-incentive for the average investor (not to mention wealthy people) to invest. He should stick to his current profession, since he obviously knows so little about business.
I wonder whether such a tax would affect funds like Matthew 25 (MXXVX - great ticker), which are structured as Pennsylvania companies. (Vanguard reorganized its funds into Delaware trusts in 1998.)
Tongue-in-cheek, Maurice..... I would run away and not vote for this guy, but not because of his suggested tax on investment trades. I keep reminding myself that I'm among the privileged to even have any money to invest. People are busting their tush just to be able to pay the bills---let alone improve their lot. Such a thought is a fading dream here in the USA.
Reply to @BobC: Taxes have never dictated any investment decisions I have ever made over 45 years, and same for Warren Buffett, as he famously declares now and then. One little and one big data. Articles similarly regularly advocate for not letting the tax tail wag the investment dog. Now, this may not be the best idea (small transaction fees would go a longer way, say most experts), but the business-ignorance and investor-disincentive arguments are weak and also not demonstrative.
Reply to @bee: The sales tax amount was credited as part of the transaction and taxing agencies were/are not involved just the buyer/seller. I don't know what you mean by claiming it as a donation to a non-profit nor the list of taxes that don't exist. I would be more concerned with your phone monitoring your activities than your car.
Reply to @Maurice: You have all the answers, Maurice, and should we assume you let taxes rule your investment decisions? Whatever your answers, it's the same man who has said, again and again, that the idea that higher tax rates will stifle investment and productivity is bunk. I like paying taxes, always have. As my investing parents pointed out long ago, It means you made a lot and did well. They did not have to add that it also helps (enables) society; we kids already knew that much.
Thanks, Crash, for reminding us that taxes are the price we pay for living in (we hope) a civilized society. Maybe we don't want to pay for it to be quite THAT civilized at times, but those who are truly unhappy can emigrate, renounce their citizenship (and their Social Security and Medicare and any other benefits, I hope - we need to pay back the Chinese; and please don't leave your parents behind in a nursing home on Medicaid - take them along also). We all are sure that our fair share of the cost is less than we are paying, but if you hang around and live until 90, you've got it all back and more, unless entitlements change. While I think entitlements must change, I'd feel a bit more optimistic if there were a whole lot fewer millionaires in Congress. I doubt they really feel my pain (and they have all these great advance stock tips, if they can avoid detection, which haas been made easier). Now, where were we? Oh, that's not what you meant,Crash? Well, bummer.
Regarding taxation, it is like the US is split into people from Mars and people from Venus. They will never see eye to eye with each other. The only time they happily co-exist is when economy is booming and it doesn't feel like a fixed pie and both philosophies seen to work.
When was the last time that your state paid you a dividend? Alaskan residents receive a "dividend" as a result of the royalties from the state resources. Maybe we need to start a conversation in this direction for other states. Pennsylvania has had a nice boost from Natural gas development...where's the benefit to the state tax payer?
How about a Floridia tourism dividend? A California Raisin Dividend? Sign me up.
I drive an 20 year old car. Recently when the building inspector, who I paid a permit fee (tax) to for the previledge of adding value to my (property taxed) home, showed up driving a brand new Ford something seemed out of whack.
Reply to @bee: >> How about a Florida tourism dividend? A California Raisin Dividend?
They come indirectly and to all in general, no? Like almost all such benefits. cman's fixed-pie perception observation is spot-on. I can only imagine how much more toxic things would feel (and be) if the market was not rising.
Reply to @davidrmoran: From my experience taxation often has a "one size fits all" or "we know best how to spend other people's money". I believe there is a disconnect that you illuded to when you say, "it indirectly benefits us all (as taxpayers) in general."
Lately, in public education, parents are pushing for the right to choose where their child goes to school. A school voucher (tax cedit) provides a mechanism for a parent (tax payer) the right and obligation to advocate for better schools with a redistribution of taxes to more effective service providers (better schools). More often there is little competition amoung government service providers to compete for tax revenues.
I can choose to pay a toll (tax) to take the Mass Pike which will provide me with a service (I'll reach my distination faster) or I can take Route 20 ( no toll) and get there a couple minutes later. I have a choice.
Maybe part of what is missing is a sense of choice and a mechanism for taxing authorities to compete for providing a service.
Reply to @bee: Of course, and good on paper, but that way can lie fiefs and worse. I don't have kids, why should I pay for schools; I'm a guy, why should I pay for maternity coverage. Etc. 'We're all in this together' --- that spirit is dead among so many. Competition too is always good, sure, on paper, but defense contractors all compete (I have been involved in many losing Darpa proposals) and it seems to have inadequate effect on quality and pricing. Not sure voucher schooling is the way. I do not have good answers always, was just responding to your 'how about a Fla tourism dividend'? Florida's likely future problems with taxation bases and adequate-revenue raising have been written to death.
Reply to @davidrmoran: We are indeed "all in this together." That's what's missing, today. You have money to spare, and you want to invest it? You're in the minority. Such a thing is becoming a dream, a luxury. And with so many millionaires in the Congress... Almost all of them are bought and paid for. Sad. Plutocracy."Representative government" represents corporations today, in 2014. Remember when that big company you once worked for learned how to ride a bike? Neither do I. Corporations are not people. (Citizens United Supreme Court decision. Hogwash.)
Reply to @Ted: While I am not in favor of (regressive) sales taxes, your salt here suggestion might be way cool; also sugar, fat .... I still hope the mil-level fin transaction tax might get traction down the road.
I have no money to spare, really, so to speak, but yes, from decades of saving I do know I and my wife are in a better position than many. Tonight am trying to decide (this is OT) why not take it all (almost, leave some for intl and small) and simply split it 50-50 b/w PRBLX and PONDX .... Compared the results of that combo over the last two years (I know, I know) with FPACX and all similar, also AOR/AOM and BERIX and GLRBX and all my other conservative faves. Assuming most bond trauma news baked in.
Comments
Indeed it is!
“When you buy a car, you pay a sales tax of 6 to 8 percent, depending on where you live in Pennsylvania. That's $1,200 to $1,600 for a $20,000 car."
In CT (where I live) not only does the first buyer of a new car pay sales tax on the full price of this new car, but subsequent buyers of this car pay a used car sales tax as part of re-registeration. This equates to double, triple, even quadrulple taxation on a car sold multiple times... Now that progressive taxation!
Suggest that the tax apply to teachers & state employees only , as they would be the ones to benefit. As , its only temporary, would that be 1 year or 100 ?!
Stay warm, Derf
'Course, wondering what the historical record of a "temporary" tax that lasts forever....yes, indeed.
So, would this gubiner candidate try to tax into/inside the 403b's and related? Ya, right. I sure would like to ask him a direct question as to how this tax would be processed. His bio indicates that he is and has been a hard working and giving/caring person; but I think he flew off the political rail with this one.
Hey, you're right...........too darn cold in MI. -1 right now and go'in to -8 or so tonight. Has been cold enough for too long..... the kind of cold that causes the house to have growls and noises of popping into the night.
Take care,
Catch
Hi bee,
If you reside in the City of Philadelphia, you have the privileged to pay this:
http://www.phila.gov/Revenue/individuals/taxes/Pages/SchoolIncomeTax.aspx
If you work and reside in the City of Philadelphia, you have the privilege to pay this:
http://www.phila.gov/Revenue/businesses/taxes/Pages/WageTax.aspx
If you sell a house in the City of Philadelphia, you have the privilege to pay this:
http://www.phila.gov/Revenue/individuals/taxes/Pages/RealtyTransferTax.aspx
I come from Woodbridge and and on a relative basis, it is far less expensive.
Mona
It's Pennsylvania! So, with respect to taxes, the devil is in the details. I used to work a few miles south of Pennsylvania in MD. 20% or more of the people who retired from my workplace who wanted to stay in the area moved across the border to Pennsylvania. They said that retirees pay little to NO income tax. This is true of 401K type withdrawals after a certain age. So, to the extent that people's savings is considered "retirement" money, they probably won't pay income tax. I used to tease them saying that once the boomers retired, those Pennsylvania tax exemptions on old people would vaporize. I still think they will at some point.
"... equates to double, triple, even quadrulple taxation on a car sold multiple times..."
They're gonna like the new aluminum F150 than. (-:
The new motor vehicle taxes will be monitored and reported directly to taxing agencies from the car itself (smart cars)...mileage use tax, excess speed tax, excessive idling tax, Fast Food drive-in restaurant tax, Urban Bass Noise reduction tax...just a few we can look forward to.
Just trying to get this thread on topic.
We all are sure that our fair share of the cost is less than we are paying, but if you hang around and live until 90, you've got it all back and more, unless entitlements change.
While I think entitlements must change, I'd feel a bit more optimistic if there were a whole lot fewer millionaires in Congress. I doubt they really feel my pain (and they have all these great advance stock tips, if they can avoid detection, which haas been made easier).
Now, where were we? Oh, that's not what you meant,Crash?
Well, bummer.
How about a Floridia tourism dividend? A California Raisin Dividend? Sign me up.
I drive an 20 year old car. Recently when the building inspector, who I paid a permit fee (tax) to for the previledge of adding value to my (property taxed) home, showed up driving a brand new Ford something seemed out of whack.
>> How about a Florida tourism dividend? A California Raisin Dividend?
They come indirectly and to all in general, no? Like almost all such benefits.
cman's fixed-pie perception observation is spot-on. I can only imagine how much more toxic things would feel (and be) if the market was not rising.
From my experience taxation often has a "one size fits all" or "we know best how to spend other people's money". I believe there is a disconnect that you illuded to when you say, "it indirectly benefits us all (as taxpayers) in general."
Lately, in public education, parents are pushing for the right to choose where their child goes to school. A school voucher (tax cedit) provides a mechanism for a parent (tax payer) the right and obligation to advocate for better schools with a redistribution of taxes to more effective service providers (better schools). More often there is little competition amoung government service providers to compete for tax revenues.
I can choose to pay a toll (tax) to take the Mass Pike which will provide me with a service (I'll reach my distination faster) or I can take Route 20 ( no toll) and get there a couple minutes later. I have a choice.
Maybe part of what is missing is a sense of choice and a mechanism for taxing authorities to compete for providing a service.
Regards,
Ted
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-morton-salt-girl-20140124,0,4313921.photogallery
I have no money to spare, really, so to speak, but yes, from decades of saving I do know I and my wife are in a better position than many. Tonight am trying to decide (this is OT) why not take it all (almost, leave some for intl and small) and simply split it 50-50 b/w PRBLX and PONDX .... Compared the results of that combo over the last two years (I know, I know) with FPACX and all similar, also AOR/AOM and BERIX and GLRBX and all my other conservative faves. Assuming most bond trauma news baked in.