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How many different mutual funds and etfs do you own?
I employe, what I call, a win, place, show investment strategy in which each investmet category that I invest in usually holds three funds. And, with that, the total comes to more than fifty funds. This includes my taxable account, my IRA account and my 401k account.
As you may note the question you inferred is not the same question I asked. I didn't ask for the correct number or the optimal number. It was a curiousity question (stated in the poll title).
My gut feeling is
people active in mutual fund forums
- have more funds (possibly twice as many as the average fund owner), which can be attributed to the following reasons...
- perceived diversification, - the latest boutique fund has opened and they want a piece of it. - more active investing to get a hopeful boost out of a fund that they found out about. - the more a fund a gets mentioned positively in discussions or has a commentary written about, the more chance a toehold in that fund will be made. - I am also of the opinion if you do your own selection and self-advise (so to speak), rather than going to an financial advisor, you tend to have more funds on average.
- etc. etc.
I am not saying anything is good or bad, but I would suggest that the average forum reader (and someone who doesn't use a financial advisor for fund picking) has a greater number of funds than the average fund owner (based on no evidence).
We used to have as many as 18 funds; currently have 10 and sort of limit ourselves to 10. Basic reason: almost 20 years of experience suggests that careful selection (i.e., identifying fund managers who are people worth trusting) is more important than having more funds that try to capture every nuance.
I'm up to nine---all open-ended funds. Too many for my liking, but I'm living these days with some 403b residue which has been rolled-over to IRA. And I like the way those funds are behaving, so I'm not going to dump 'em yet. To further diversify (sort of) I recently added two more to my existing bunch, which takes me to nine. Some are grossly overweighted, other represent just 3% or so of holdings.
Reply to @Accipiter: Thanks for taking the trouble to set-up this poll and also to the respondents willing to share. Also, you have explained some good reasons why the poll may be skewed a certain way. Overlooked - at least in part - is a considerable amount of "sampling bias." A couple ways that comes into play: (1) Sample Bias #1 - Those who login to MFO are more likely to be "active" investors with an above average interest in funds - and as a consequence may own a larger than normal number of funds than fund investors who don't visit the site. (2) Sample Bias #2 - MFO participants are comfortable using the Internet - not true of the total population (especially the 60+ group). We can assume a significant % also buy, trade, sell funds over the Internet. There are statistics out there showing that those who access their fund accounts via the Internet actually buy and sell funds more often than those who don't. - I'd expect that more buying and selling translates into an overall larger number of funds owned.
Still find this poll both interesting and of value. Having done one myself before, I can appreciate the time and effort you put into it.
Hank: Thanks, but I have only held PRHSX & PFF the entire year. Recently, have retaken a position in SPY & QQQ that I sold in late spring to move to bond funds. I like equities over bonds for the remainder of the year, Regards, Ted
20 mutual funds over 4 IRA/Roth IRA/401k accounts between me and wife.
Top 5: 46.13% of the portfolio. Top 10: 71.73% of the portfolio
Bottom 5: 6.21% of the portfolio Bottom 10: 28.27% of the portfolio
I guess my portfolio could have been downsized to 12-15 funds easily but I hold a number of token positions in small cap funds, some of which are closed
Archaic reminds me of the Buffet suggestion that you get a limited number of choices, like punches on a card. I am trimming my numbers for the same reasons.
Reply to @Rbrt: Makes sense. If you maintain a pretty constant number - even some that are similar - when one turns sour you weed it out in favor of the stronger ones. I like to do this slowly, as it can take years to confirm than a fund has gone bad - not just hit a rough patch. Case in point: QRAAX was one of the first (I think the very first) commodities funds - approved by the SEC in '97. Paid the "A" load the following year to get some commodity exposure previously unavailable through mutual funds. Nice ride first 10 years as it more than tripled in value. For whatever reason, it fell off a cliff starting in '08 and has never recovered. Been slowly shifting into PRAFX and PRPFX which already owned.
- PS: Commodity funds seem to encounter greater turbulence due to changes in SEC regulations, accounting procedures, tax codes and legislation. QRAAX relies on derivatives and is probably more vulnerable to these forces than others might be. fwiw
My core positions are about 10% and the others, never less than 5% of the total value. Less than 5%, they don't seem to have much impact on the total performance. Given those restrictions, I have 17 funds.
Hi johnN, If you "edit" these tickers to caps; everyone will be able to hover for the name; and also right click here at MFO, for further review, via their chosen web site. Regards, Catch
I am now down to three - PONDX, ANGIX, and MNHYX. Lost patience with MWCRX and replaced it with ANGIX. I can see where I will soon be only in PONDX and ANGIX. As long as I can get equity-like fund returns from bond funds and with less than half and more the volatility, will stick with bonds. Also, as I get older, I try to contain any drawdown as much possible and that is much easier with bond funds than equity funds.
Hey Hiyield007, Was just about to "ping" you here to ask about the transistion that has been in place since about Sept. 13 in some of the HY/HI stuff. But, your list above tells the story. You have already moved. We don't use HYG or JNK; but both have been going backwards. The active managed HY funds we hold are holding okay; but keeping a close eye. May be a bit more PONDX at this house, too. Checked on your noted holding of ANGIX; which holds a bunch of non-agency mortgage stuff, eh; but this fund is not available via Fidelity. Take care, Catch
Reply to @catch22: Mark, ANGIX is available where I trade (Scottrade) and in smaller amounts than the 1m minimum shown on Morningstar. It is a fee fund though and I hold much more in PONDX. Not sure why I even went into ANGIX because to me it is just a duplication of PONDX. Seems like the brain trusts at PIMCO, DoubleLine, and TCW are big on non-agency mortgage stuff. I am sure on days like today you enjoy your 100% bond portfolio even more.
I tend to agree with HiYield...hard to ignore equity-like returns with bond funds right now, while it lasts.
I recently sold RPHYX, adding to AQRIX.
Never did follow-through with ARIVX, after broker delay...covered for now with FAAFX, but did I pare back on it after recent advance to reduce portfolio volatility, which is currently under 10%.
So, six sweet funds.
Would like to get down to five or less in months ahead, but we will see...some other constraints in play for me.
Comments
(3 - 5 should be adequate. But ... whatever oils your clock-:)
I employe, what I call, a win, place, show investment strategy in which each investmet category that I invest in usually holds three funds. And, with that, the total comes to more than fifty funds. This includes my taxable account, my IRA account and my 401k account.
Good Investing,
Skeeter
As you may note the question you inferred is not the same question I asked. I didn't ask for the correct number or the optimal number. It was a curiousity question (stated in the poll title).
My gut feeling is
people active in mutual fund forums
- have more funds (possibly twice as many as the average fund owner), which can be attributed to the following reasons...
- perceived diversification,
- the latest boutique fund has opened and they want a piece of it.
- more active investing to get a hopeful boost out of a fund that they found out about.
- the more a fund a gets mentioned positively in discussions or has a commentary written about, the more chance a toehold in that fund will be made.
- I am also of the opinion if you do your own selection and self-advise (so to speak), rather than going to an financial advisor, you tend to have more funds on average.
- etc. etc.
I am not saying anything is good or bad, but I would suggest that the average forum reader (and someone who doesn't use a financial advisor for fund picking) has a greater number of funds than the average fund owner (based on no evidence).
FWIW,
Archaic
I think I've followed the same trajectory as you (but starting from a higher number), but not quite down to 10 yet.
Regards,
Ted
PowerShares NASDAQ-100( QQQ)
SPDR S&P 500 (SPY)
iShares Preferred Stock Index Fund (PFF)
T. Rowe Price Health Sciences Fund (PRHSX)
Still find this poll both interesting and of value. Having done one myself before, I can appreciate the time and effort you put into it.
Brief article about sampling bias. http://onlinestatbook.com/2/research_design/sampling.html
-PowerShares NASDAQ-100( QQQ) +26.47%
-SPDR S&P 500 (SPY) +17.89%
-iShares Preferred Stock Index Fund (PFF) +16.38%
-T. Rowe Price Health Sciences Fund (PRHSX) +35.52%
Regards, hank
Regards,
Ted
1 fund of funds
5 ETFs/CEFs
Top 5: 46.13% of the portfolio.
Top 10: 71.73% of the portfolio
Bottom 5: 6.21% of the portfolio
Bottom 10: 28.27% of the portfolio
I guess my portfolio could have been downsized to 12-15 funds easily but I hold a number of token positions in small cap funds, some of which are closed
- PS: Commodity funds seem to encounter greater turbulence due to changes in SEC regulations, accounting procedures, tax codes and legislation. QRAAX relies on derivatives and is probably more vulnerable to these forces than others might be. fwiw
These are the main/mostly concentrated ones
PRPFX
PSPFX
LSBRX
VPCCX
VGSTX
QQQQ
SPY
PFF
VHT
VEU
If you "edit" these tickers to caps; everyone will be able to hover for the name; and also right click here at MFO, for further review, via their chosen web site.
Regards,
Catch
Was just about to "ping" you here to ask about the transistion that has been in place since about Sept. 13 in some of the HY/HI stuff. But, your list above tells the story. You have already moved.
We don't use HYG or JNK; but both have been going backwards. The active managed HY funds we hold are holding okay; but keeping a close eye.
May be a bit more PONDX at this house, too. Checked on your noted holding of ANGIX; which holds a bunch of non-agency mortgage stuff, eh; but this fund is not available via Fidelity.
Take care,
Catch
AQRIX
FAAFX
WBMIX
SFGIX
DODBX
Highest to lowest portfolio holdings.
I tend to agree with HiYield...hard to ignore equity-like returns with bond funds right now, while it lasts.
I recently sold RPHYX, adding to AQRIX.
Never did follow-through with ARIVX, after broker delay...covered for now with FAAFX, but did I pare back on it after recent advance to reduce portfolio volatility, which is currently under 10%.
So, six sweet funds.
Would like to get down to five or less in months ahead, but we will see...some other constraints in play for me.
But Ted...hats-off to your selection. Superb.