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Hi guys! It's time to open this thread to ALL who come to the board. If you're playing along at home and have a portfolio you want to discuss it, your turn is now. Let's see what you have. God bless the Pudd
But FWIW, I have 1/2 my retirement savings in a Schwab robo-portfolio, which is about 62% equity, 28% bonds and 10% cash. As of 11/24, the robo has returned 13.3% YTD. The percentage is based on $ amounts from 1/1 to 11/24. Up to others to judge if that is good or bad, but I'm happy with the the robo so far. I tend to be too conservative some times and the robo helps not over-think everything.
The self managed portfolio is less aggressive. Most of it has been pretty steady, fund/percentage wise, but I like to play with stocks with a small part of the total and my stocks have changed over the year. I also have adjusted and re-adjusted the bond funds a couple of times. Not sure why I don't just put all the bond allocation in PONDX and be done with it. But what fun is that?
M* instant xray shows the self managed portfolio percentages to be: CASH 17 U.S. STOCK 21 FOREIGN STOCK 22 BONDS 34 OTHER 7
The self managed, which has consistently been conservative at about 40-45% equity, has returned 12.1% YTD. I think that is pretty good. Again, that's based on real dollars, not M* calculated.
the self managed portfolio consists of:
EQUITY and BALANCED FUNDS: PRWCX Allocation--50% to 70% Lcap ICMBX Allocation--50% to 70% Scap DSENX LV- unfavored S&P500 sectors GTLOX Lcap Blend GPGOX World Stock SGENX World Allocation FMIJX Foreign LC Blend SFGIX Diversified Emerging Mkts
BOND FUNDS: MAINX Asia Centrix Bond Fund PGMSX TRP Global Multi-Sector PFIDX Low Duration floating Income PONDX Multisector Bond
Individual Stocks: V Visa VLO Valero Energy BABA Alibaba QCP Quality Care Properties
I do think I own to many bond funds. I'll likely cut back. I also plan to move some money from DSENX to DLEUX. I think Europe may have better value and that is what these 2 funds are all about.
For the record, I will be 64 in 2018 and plan to retire from full time work. I'll likely work part time because I get bored easy. I have been doing a lot of thinking, setting up spreadsheets and reading about setting myself up for withdrawals. Looking forward to more discussions on that theme.
The robo at 13.3% YTD is eye-catching. I have no experience with robo. I looked at T. Rowe Price’s funds (more or less out of habit) to see how their target date funds compared. Price’s website puts their Target Date 2025 fund (TRRVX) as of 11/24 at +13.53% YTD (although Lipper has it a bit lower).
From Price’s website, the current composition is:
Domestic Bond 35.1% Domestic Stock 33.9% Foreign Stock 18.2% Foreign Bond 10.1% Cash 2.8% Convertibles 0.3% Preferred .02%
Looks like TRRVX’s total equity weighting is in the 50-55% range (and about where Lipper puts it).
As I think you know, I never offer advice (It would be dangerous!) So just trying to glean what I can from your serve.
I’ll share that my benchmark, TRRIX, is only up +9.5% YTD. I lag it by about a percent. Some of that has to do with an injection of $$ from a real estate sale last summer. That slug of $$ only started earning at mid-year, but due to my poor math aptitude I include the sum in the year’s starting total for computing purposes.
Good luck. Thanks for the informative presentation.
@hank, I have the same issues with cash flows and there are 2 ways I deal with it. In a simple world where there's only one instance, such as your real estate sale, you can take the gain for the year and divide it by the beginning of year balance plus half of the cash added from the real estate sale. Regardless of when that cash flow happens during the year you just have to add the percentage of the cash that's equivalent to the portion of the year it was earning.
In a slightly more complicated world, I would keep a M* portfolio of TRRIX where the value in the benchmark is the same as the value in your portfolio at the beginning of the year and then add/subtract the same amount to the benchmark portfolio as you add/subtract to your own portfolio each time there's a cash flow impact during the year. That doesn't help with calculating the return you've earned but it does make it easy to benchmark based on the value of the two portfolios.
Thanks LLJB - Really interesting examples. Will give them some thought.
This was an unusual year. Not likely to repeat - although even pulling distributions at mid-year tends to throw in a monkey wrench. Over longer periods my crude approach tends to even-out. Had the markets plunged instead of risen after mid-year, adding the real estate proceeds at that point would have exaggerated the YTD on the positive side.
Agree on TRP target date funds @hank. They certainly are a good alternative to a robo portfolio for sure. I know you use them as a benchmark and so have I over the years.
We here at MFO do get enjoyment doing our own thing, but frankly these funds are not easy to beat over the long haul. Mostly I think they are hard to beat because we humans have this ingrained perception that we can tinker with our portfolios and make it better - win the game. The tinkering is what kills us IMHO, and I have to include myself over the years in that assessment.
Wishing you the very best in your coming retirement.
If my memory is correct from viewing the now removed whoops portfolio the yield was at about 1.56% per my Instant Xray analysis; and, it was geared towards growth over income. Since, I am in retirement myself the yield is a little low for me. I take no more distribution than 1/2 of what my five year average return has been. In this way, my portfolio grows over time. In addition, you can (I believe) get your broker to set your account to where you can take all mutual fund distributions (interest, dividends and capital gains) in cash. This should raise your portfolio's income stream and prevent you from having to, perhaps, sell securities (piecemeal) to raise cash. I have found Morningstar's portfolio manager a good way to track a consolidated portfolio of multiple accounts. And, I have found it to be most reliable in tracking long term investment performance. Sure, it may have some short term glitches but overall it has been a good investment management tool.
Again, wishing you the very best as you approach retirement.
Thanks @Old_Skeet. Yes, my "whoops" was from hitting the "post comment" button well before my information was ready. I do have 2 retirement accounts, an IRA at Schwab and a 401K at TRP, and I was trying to combine both in the post, but I didn't have the percentages correct yet. So, I tried to quickly delete with the edit function.
In any case, I would like to start a thread, maybe early next year, on how other retiree's withdraw from their nest-eggs. Exactly the kind of info you offered above. I have done some research on my own so I have some ideas. I will likely meet with my Schwab adviser early next year to talk over options and hear what he has to say.
Hi MikeM, Have owned ICMBX. Did Eric run this....I forget. Also ownedGTLOX....a casualty of downsizing. Also have FMIJX. These guys.....if they ever stop being bears, I will know we are in the heart of a recession or depression. Also own PONDX. Can somebody please explain to me what they do? It's the only fund I own that I don't understand. SFGIX.....why don't I own this fund? I've asked myself this more than once. I, too, have cut back on bonds. We all know why. As far as retirement, MikeM, it's beautiful. Do it! No stress. No problems and ..... it's always 5:00 somewhere, Bro! LOL God bless the Pudd
p.s. BABA - good job! Also what do you think of Matthews? I used to own 2 of their funds. Now, none. I now think of them as overpriced and under achieving. Just me saying.....
p.s.s. You aren't responsible for American Airlines' problems, are you? With whoops.......see CNBC.com.
Hi @Puddnhead, If you are referring to Eric Cinnamond, I believe he was part of the ICMBX team but I don't think he was ever the lead manager. I could be wrong. I think he was lead manager for Intrepid's small cap fund. You know, I was in his River Road small cap fund when it opened when he went out on his own. It really wasn't his deep value theme that turned me away. It was his persistence to be heavy in mining companies and energy when those sectors were collapsing. I believe he succumbed to the term "value trap", which to me is a sin for a mutual fund manager. In any case, below is what I found from M* in a Google search for "ICMBX Cinnamond".
Eric K. Cinnamond 01/28/2010 — 09/02/2010: Mr. Cinnamond serves as Portfolio Manager for River Road’s Independent Value Portfolio. Prior to joining River Road in 2010, Mr. Cinnamond served as Lead Portfolio Manager of Intrepid Capital Management’s small cap strategy, Co-Portfolio Manager and Analyst at Evergreen Asset Management, and Portfolio Manager at First Union National Bank of Florida. Mr. Cinnamond holds a B.B.A. in Finance from Stetson University and an M.B.A. from the University of Florida. He earned the Chartered Financial Analyst® designation in 1996 and is a member of the CFA Institute.
Also what do you think of Matthews? I used to own 2 of their funds. Now, none. I now think of them as overpriced and under achieving. Just me saying.....
If someone wants to weight the Asian region on their own, I personally think Matthews funds are the best way to do that. I own SFGIX though, which has a heavy dose of Asia, both developed and EM. GPGOX also is quite heavy Asia. In fact, M* xray has my portfolio over-weight Asia in the foreign sector. These fund managers are a bit smarter then me, so I don't think I need a sector or region fund. To me it dilutes their (my fund managers) expertise. Hell, that's why I'm paying them.
All that (regional weighting) said though, I am strongly considering combining my percentage in DSENX fund with DLEUX to get a bit more of the CAPE value theme with developed European. Same process, more value(?) That's my thinking anyway.
MM, It was and is my thinking too, to an extent, but DLEUX has not done as well as hoped (he said to the fates). Its performance (which is effectively ytd) notably lags OAKIX and FOSFX (yes, they have nontrivial slugs elsewhere, esp Fido's). I am not going to bail without assessing for another year at least; just an fyi. I ditched OAKIX because Hero is such a warming denialist, but I would jump back into FOSFX in a jiffy in 2019 if DLEUX simply still does not add value. Or by then I might just revert to DSEEX, thinking more like Waggoner about foreign investing.
Comments
But FWIW, I have 1/2 my retirement savings in a Schwab robo-portfolio, which is about 62% equity, 28% bonds and 10% cash. As of 11/24, the robo has returned 13.3% YTD. The percentage is based on $ amounts from 1/1 to 11/24. Up to others to judge if that is good or bad, but I'm happy with the the robo so far. I tend to be too conservative some times and the robo helps not over-think everything.
The self managed portfolio is less aggressive. Most of it has been pretty steady, fund/percentage wise, but I like to play with stocks with a small part of the total and my stocks have changed over the year. I also have adjusted and re-adjusted the bond funds a couple of times. Not sure why I don't just put all the bond allocation in PONDX and be done with it. But what fun is that?
M* instant xray shows the self managed portfolio percentages to be:
CASH 17
U.S. STOCK 21
FOREIGN STOCK 22
BONDS 34
OTHER 7
The self managed, which has consistently been conservative at about 40-45% equity, has returned 12.1% YTD. I think that is pretty good. Again, that's based on real dollars, not M* calculated.
the self managed portfolio consists of:
EQUITY and BALANCED FUNDS:
PRWCX Allocation--50% to 70% Lcap
ICMBX Allocation--50% to 70% Scap
DSENX LV- unfavored S&P500 sectors
GTLOX Lcap Blend
GPGOX World Stock
SGENX World Allocation
FMIJX Foreign LC Blend
SFGIX Diversified Emerging Mkts
BOND FUNDS:
MAINX Asia Centrix Bond Fund
PGMSX TRP Global Multi-Sector
PFIDX Low Duration floating Income
PONDX Multisector Bond
Individual Stocks:
V Visa
VLO Valero Energy
BABA Alibaba
QCP Quality Care Properties
I do think I own to many bond funds. I'll likely cut back. I also plan to move some money from DSENX to DLEUX. I think Europe may have better value and that is what these 2 funds are all about.
For the record, I will be 64 in 2018 and plan to retire from full time work. I'll likely work part time because I get bored easy. I have been doing a lot of thinking, setting up spreadsheets and reading about setting myself up for withdrawals. Looking forward to more discussions on that theme.
The robo at 13.3% YTD is eye-catching. I have no experience with robo. I looked at T. Rowe Price’s funds (more or less out of habit) to see how their target date funds compared. Price’s website puts their Target Date 2025 fund (TRRVX) as of 11/24 at +13.53% YTD (although Lipper has it a bit lower).
From Price’s website, the current composition is:
Domestic Bond 35.1%
Domestic Stock 33.9%
Foreign Stock 18.2%
Foreign Bond 10.1%
Cash 2.8%
Convertibles 0.3%
Preferred .02%
Looks like TRRVX’s total equity weighting is in the 50-55% range (and about where Lipper puts it).
As I think you know, I never offer advice (It would be dangerous!) So just trying to glean what I can from your serve.
I’ll share that my benchmark, TRRIX, is only up +9.5% YTD. I lag it by about a percent. Some of that has to do with an injection of $$ from a real estate sale last summer. That slug of $$ only started earning at mid-year, but due to my poor math aptitude I include the sum in the year’s starting total for computing purposes.
Good luck. Thanks for the informative presentation.
In a slightly more complicated world, I would keep a M* portfolio of TRRIX where the value in the benchmark is the same as the value in your portfolio at the beginning of the year and then add/subtract the same amount to the benchmark portfolio as you add/subtract to your own portfolio each time there's a cash flow impact during the year. That doesn't help with calculating the return you've earned but it does make it easy to benchmark based on the value of the two portfolios.
This was an unusual year. Not likely to repeat - although even pulling distributions at mid-year tends to throw in a monkey wrench. Over longer periods my crude approach tends to even-out. Had the markets plunged instead of risen after mid-year, adding the real estate proceeds at that point would have exaggerated the YTD on the positive side.
We here at MFO do get enjoyment doing our own thing, but frankly these funds are not easy to beat over the long haul. Mostly I think they are hard to beat because we humans have this ingrained perception that we can tinker with our portfolios and make it better - win the game. The tinkering is what kills us IMHO, and I have to include myself over the years in that assessment.
Wishing you the very best in your coming retirement.
If my memory is correct from viewing the now removed whoops portfolio the yield was at about 1.56% per my Instant Xray analysis; and, it was geared towards growth over income. Since, I am in retirement myself the yield is a little low for me. I take no more distribution than 1/2 of what my five year average return has been. In this way, my portfolio grows over time. In addition, you can (I believe) get your broker to set your account to where you can take all mutual fund distributions (interest, dividends and capital gains) in cash. This should raise your portfolio's income stream and prevent you from having to, perhaps, sell securities (piecemeal) to raise cash. I have found Morningstar's portfolio manager a good way to track a consolidated portfolio of multiple accounts. And, I have found it to be most reliable in tracking long term investment performance. Sure, it may have some short term glitches but overall it has been a good investment management tool.
Again, wishing you the very best as you approach retirement.
Old_Skeet
In any case, I would like to start a thread, maybe early next year, on how other retiree's withdraw from their nest-eggs. Exactly the kind of info you offered above. I have done some research on my own so I have some ideas. I will likely meet with my Schwab adviser early next year to talk over options and hear what he has to say.
Thanks again skeeter!
Have owned ICMBX. Did Eric run this....I forget. Also ownedGTLOX....a casualty of downsizing. Also have FMIJX.
These guys.....if they ever stop being bears, I will know we are in the heart of a recession or depression. Also own PONDX. Can somebody please explain to me what they do? It's the only fund I own that I don't understand.
SFGIX.....why don't I own this fund? I've asked myself this more than once. I, too, have cut back on bonds. We all know why. As far as retirement, MikeM, it's beautiful. Do it! No stress. No problems and ..... it's always 5:00 somewhere, Bro! LOL
God bless
the Pudd
p.s. BABA - good job!
Also what do you think of Matthews? I used to own 2 of their funds. Now, none. I now think of them as overpriced and under achieving. Just me saying.....
p.s.s.
You aren't responsible for American Airlines' problems, are you? With whoops.......see CNBC.com.
All that (regional weighting) said though, I am strongly considering combining my percentage in DSENX fund with DLEUX to get a bit more of the CAPE value theme with developed European. Same process, more value(?) That's my thinking anyway.
It was and is my thinking too, to an extent, but DLEUX has not done as well as hoped (he said to the fates). Its performance (which is effectively ytd) notably lags OAKIX and FOSFX (yes, they have nontrivial slugs elsewhere, esp Fido's). I am not going to bail without assessing for another year at least; just an fyi. I ditched OAKIX because Hero is such a warming denialist, but I would jump back into FOSFX in a jiffy in 2019 if DLEUX simply still does not add value. Or by then I might just revert to DSEEX, thinking more like Waggoner about foreign investing.