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A quick heads-up: this discussion was flagged. We did, indeed, seem to be getting rather more heated, and more personal, than is healthy. So, I closed the thread and deleted some of the more personal commentary. Subsequent readers might notice some disjointed remarks, many of which might simply refer back to now-deleted content.
Back to wondering whether the euro at $1.12 means I could afford to visit family in Ireland this year. It's a happy thought. David
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Is this supposed to help drive the president's idea of free tuition for two years at community colleges?
Don't get it.....
That's a non-starter with Republicans controlling both houses.
Not sure why he would even try to put that out there
I got the time and ideas for Econ. 101 term paper....
Khan Academy
One may attend for free; and contribute, too.
I agree with the maxims of Rev. William John Henry Boetcker originally published in 1916:
• You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
• You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
• You cannot help little men by tearing down big men.
• You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.
• You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich.
• You cannot establish sound security on borrowed money.
• You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
• You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than you earn.
• You cannot build character and courage by destroying men's initiative and independence.
• You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they can and should do for themselves.
Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan had the same thoughts about wealth redistribution. Here is a classic Margaret Thatcher moment:
Kevin
Regards,
Ted
Thank you for putting this subject forward here.
I get tired of "notes" to our Senators/Reps about various topics; but this is a good one to discover what type of response I receive as to why such a proposal would find its way into the conversation regarding "tax fairness" and "helping the middle class". An "out of touch" proposal. One would suspect that this is tied in with the "free" two years of community college proposal. Take the tax dollars from 529 distributions to offset the free college, eh?
Ah, the games (D.C.) make me feel like I am going to puke.
Take care of you and yours,
Catch
Prepare your family.
The Life Cycles of Empires: Lessons for America Today?
http://www.ucg.org/united-states/life-cycles-empires-lessons-america-today/
tb's remarks are interesting to me because of the rather unpredictable mix of reasonable and logical commentary with obvious absurdities such as the above quote.
I am a Vietnam war veteran. I was called to duty and served 1965-1966. I had 2 small children at that time. I was with a group that was stationed in a( Mash) Evacuation Hospital. I saw a lot of sacrifice that the men and women serving their country made.
Many did not come home. Those who were lucky enough to return like myself were able to take advantage of G.I. Benefits. For myself ,I was able to become a physician.
MikeM I am disappointed in your comments. Why don't you tell us all what you have done for our country.
prinx
As a single dad I was able to make it while being dirt poor (although msf and another poster doubt me). My ex, I'm sure could not have made it without tapping the safety system. Does that mean she's a lazy, unmotivated dirtbag? She is, but for different reasons. Our president couldn't even get republican agreement when he spoke last night about equal pay for women. Their hands must have been cold.
@Lewis - stop trying to confuse the right with the facts.
@TB - If you're serious about improving someone by giving then volunteering is a concept you should explore. I've seen it lift many.
@MikeM was defending government programs by taking a post to its eventual conclusion.
I am 100% certain from his comment he supports continued Veteran's benefits and would cite the GI Bill as a staggering success. Cable news's institutional need to replace reportage with ideologically based opinion and misinformation, the nature of the internet as an echo chamber, and the resulting inability of the American citizenry to have anything resembling a civil or nuanced conversation?
Activist hat, off.
Edit: Probably more snark than necessary on my part. By and large people here actually are very well informed and have some decent discussions. I do think the discourse in America is terribly low as a society, however.
Here are a few of the mere facts.
It's the dollar based on nothing but a promise. It's easy to inflate the value of stocks. What is your value of stocks in the terms of 1960 dollars? I bet you lost you're ass - compliments of your politicians. It's the social security lock box. Its Dian Feinstein's statement that "we don't know what is in Obama care bill till it becomes law". It's the promises politicians have made to get elected. It's the deadbeats in this country that think the world owes them a living. It's the insurance companies that get in between you and your doctor. It's the credit card companies that get in between you money and what you purchase. Its the lack of tort reform that is bringing every industry to their financial knees. Its the pension system that will be worthless when you come to need it. Its the increasing taxes that are based on false promises. I don't see any distinction between any of the modern political parties. Politicians would go broke if they had to work for a living. It's a travesty to create debt that your grand children will be saddled with
In terms of 1960 dollars and lifestyle we have all lost our ass !!
Do I dare say more
So my words were absolutely sarcasm. I was trying to make a point on Tampa Bays statement "I have never seen one human being IMPROVE himself by giving him something, esp. money". Some times people need help. The GI bill is the best example to refute TB's statement. It not only improved their lives, but it improved the prosperity and helped build the middle class of this country. Build an educated work force by allowing deserving people free education - the GI Bill. Why not now? Build an educated work force to help rebuild the middle class. That was my argument that fell through the cracks.
I'm truly sorry that I offended, especially the veterans on this board.
Some people decide to take action on their own, investing for their future, and becoming more independent. As their assets grow, the government decides they have put away too much and it's not fair to the others. More taxes and changed regulations hamper attempts for anyone trying to do the same.
As someone probably said; I didn't know I was rich until the government told me so.
Gary's mere facts are lolz fantastic, so weird. 1960. Whoa.
+1, and more, to LewisB. Keep at it, dude, seriously.
But lets get back to my point. Would an educated work force be beneficial to growing the middle class today? Yes or no? If the answer is yes like I believe, then lets go back to the start of my road as you put it. That's what TB said and that is unequivocally not true.
So, answer the questions and I'm done. Would an educated work force be beneficial to growing the middle class today? Would benefiting the middle class be good for America? ...If you could only get over the "earned" thing. That is your issue.
We need a sarcasm font!
(Sarc)
Today, the GI Bill is completely abused by the for profit colleges that provide minimal education or job opportunities. Why are the prices for these for profit colleges so darn high. Because of the GI Bill and Gov't subsidized loans that can't be written off in bankruptcy. Instead of encouraging community colleges and state schools, the military allows the for profit college to sucker punch the enlisted as well as the taxpayers.
Listen to a director of military education programs for a not-for-profit, private college:
"Providing $100 gift cards to government employees as a “thank you” for inviting the college they represent to an education fair should only be defended in a judicial court. Enrolling traumatic brain injury-wounded warriors into an online program without providing necessary support for that wounded warrior to even have a chance of success, in my opinion, borders on the criminal as well. Dismal completion rates, poor job placement of the few graduates who make it through the college, maximum student loan debt ratios and repeated Department of Education fines for everything from outright Pell Grant fraud to nefarious recruitment practices leaves little to defend; however, it would behoove all institutions to look critically at what for-profit colleges are doing right, before dismissing them altogether."
http://www.military.com/education/finding-a-school/in-defense-of-for-profit-colleges.html
Sorry, it is just too rife for abuse, must be shut down.
Like the saying that variable annuities are sold not bought, so too are these for profit schools.
Just like housing - location is important - Harvard Vs Palooka U.
Just like housing - there are interest groups lobbying Gov't but no one does it for the students.
One of the reasons college is pushed/needed is because the schooling prior to it can be poor and has not changed/adapted.
Another factor is that businesses no longer have apprentice jobs.
I am extremely lucky. I was able to pay for college working minimum wage jobs and no loans. Today that college is $60,000+/year.